Author Topic: Service dates revisited (Read 1116 times)

Batz · « **on:** November 10, 2003, 02:13:54 AM »

compiled by karnak from this thread:

http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=26235&highlight=Service+Date

Quote

U.S.Army:
A-20G ... 5-42
B-17G ... 6-43*
B-26B ... 5-42
C-47A ... 12-41
P-38L ... 7-44
P-40B ... 1-41
P-40E ... 8-41
P-47D-11 ... 1-44?*
P-47D-25 ... 4-44
P-47D-30 ... 10-44
P-51B ... 12-43
P51D ... 5-44?*

U.S.Navy:
F4F-4 ... 41?
FM-2 ... 9-43
F4U-1 ... 10-42
F4U-1D ... 4-44
F4U-1C ... 4-45
F4U-4 ... 4-45
F6F-5 ... 7-44
SBD-5 ... 5-43?*
TBM-3 ... 1-42

British:
Boston MK III ... 5-41
Hurricane Mk I ... 12-37
Hurricane IIC ... 4-41
Hurricane IID ... 6-42
Lancaster III ... 3-42*
Mosquito Mk VI ... 7-43
Seafire IIC ... 10-42
Spitfire Mk IA ... 6-38
Spitfire V ... 4-41
Spitfire Mk IX ... 7-42
Spitfire Mk XIV ... 1-44!*
Tempest V ... 5-44
Typhoon ... 6-42*

Russian:
Il-2 Type 3 ... 10-42
La-5FN ... 3-43
La-7 ... 6-44
Yak-9T ... 1-43
Yak-9U ... 3-44

Italian:
C.202 ... 11-41
C.205 ... 1-43

Japanese:
A6M2 ... 7-40
A6M5b ... 3-44!*
D3A-1 ... ?-37!
Ki-61-I-KAIc ... 1-44!
Ki-67 ... 4-44!*
N1K2-J ... 11-44?*

German:
Ar 234B ... 12-44
Bf 109E-4 ... 5-40
Bf 109F-4 ... 6-41
Bf 109G-2 ... 5-42
Bf 109G-6 ... 10-42
Bf 109G-10 ... 3-44
Bf 110C-4b ... 7-40
Bf 110G-2 ... 5-42
Fw 190A-5 ... 3-43
Fw 190A-8 ... 2-44
Fw 190D-9 ... 9-44
Fw 190F-8 ... 3-44?
Ju 88A-4 ... 12-40
Me 262 ... 7-44
Ta 152H ... 2-45

Notes:

*B-17G ... 6-43; The B-17G did enter service in 1943, however the B-17G in AH has the stepped waist guns and improved tail turret of a 1944 B-17G. This shouldn't have too much impact on gameplay though, being mainly limited to the greater range of movement in the tail turret.

*P-47D-11 ... 1-44?; This is based on my recollections of statements made by others in the "Give the P-47D-11 a paddle bladed prop" threads. However, given that the AH P-47D-11 lacks the paddle bladded prop it is a decent approximation of a P-47D-5, which entered service in 3-43.

*P51D ... 5-44?; The P-51D entered production in 2-44, so it clearly did not enter service in 1-44. I have looked and looked for a service entry date or a theatre arrival date for the P-51D, but have not (shockingly so given the aircraft's fame), been able to find even a hind. I am guestimating a 3 month lag between entering production and entering service.

*SBD-5 ... 5-43?; The SBD-5 entered production in 2-43, so like the P-51D I am guestimating a 3 month lag from production to service. I only found this information tonight (of course, I only looked for it tonight ) and have to admit to being somewhat disappointed in HTC about it. The SBD-5 introduced the 1,200hp R-1820-60, which brought with it a noticable performance jump. The SBD-2 and SBD-3 that fought the Battles of Coral Sea and Midway were powered by a 1,000hp engine and the SBD-2 lacked the dual rear gun. At the same time as we have a late SBD, we have an early D3A. The D3A1 is the aircraft that the Japanese used at Pearl Harbor, Coral Sea and Midway, but like the US with the SBD a better version was to be produced in greater quantity. The D3A2 entered production in 8-42 and boosted the top speed of the D3A by 39mph. As it is in AH, the US gets a over boosted aircraft and is in an artificial position of technical superiority, or greater superiority, than they should be.

*Lancaster III ... 3-42; The .50 calibre guns in the AH Lanc's tail mark it as a late war Lancaster, probably 1944. However, that change, particularly in light of its paltry ammunition supply (I'd probably prefer four .303s with 4,000 rounds), shouldn't have too much of an impact on the game. Limiting early access to the Lanc based on the tail turret might be justified.

*Spitfire Mk XIV ... 1-44!; The Spitfire entered service with 610 Squadron on January 3rd, 1944. 3-44 is the date of the first kill (a Ju88), but it was operational and on patrols prior to that.

*Typhoon ... 6-42; The only significant change, in the context of AH, that I am aware of is the change to a bubble canopy in late 1943. The performance of the Typhoon Mk Ib, so far as I can tell, remained relatively unchanged. The major difference between a 1942 Typhoon and a 1944 Typhoon was in it's reliability, which is a non-issue in AH.

*A6M5b ... 3-44!; The only difference between an A6M5a, which entered service in 1-44, and an A6M5b is the switching of one of the 7.7mm machine guns in the cowling for a 12.7mm machine gun. Substituting the A6M5b for A6M5b is reasonable. The A6M5 entered service in 8-43, but was significantly less pretected than the A6M5b. Nonetheless, this switch is probably still reasonable.

*Ki-67 ... 4-44!; The Ki-67 entered service with the IJA in 4-44. The first IJN usage as a torpedo bomber is in 10-44. Most Ki-67s were built in 1945.

*N1K2-J ... 11-44?; Production began in of the N1K2-J began in 6-44 and I have seen data that claiming that 60 were delivered in 1944. My best source for N1K2 combat entry is 150 miles away from me right now.

Any revisions?

Guppy35 · « **Reply #1 on:** November 10, 2003, 02:29:12 AM »

On the 51D entering service. Late May early June 44 is about right. Flight leaders and Squadron commanders were flying them just prior to D-Day. James Goodson of the 4th FG went down in his 51D-5NA June 20th. The 4th FG histories I have say they got them a few days before D-Day

Spit XIV-610 Squadron got their first XIV on January 6, 1944 when they picked up 8 aircraft from Exeter Airport, South Devon where they'd been delivered from 33 and 39 MU. They were doing local familiarization flights in February interspersed with convoy patrols. By the end of February 1944 they were at full strength with 19 aircraft. 91 Squadron was next, turning in their XIIs for XIVs at the end of February-early March 1944 followed by 322 Dutch Squadron which got their first XIVs on April 10, 1944

Dan/Slack

VO101_Isegrim · « **Reply #2 on:** November 10, 2003, 06:29:53 AM »

Regarding Bf 109 introduction dates :

G-6 was first introduced in service in February 1943 in the Med. Jagdgruppen. First known combat loss on 4th March 1943 of 5./JG 53.

G-10 was first issued to units in October 1944, not in spring as some publications suggest. However, if for game purposes the G-10 also represents the Bf 109 G-6/AS, G-6/ASM, G-14/AS, G-14/ASM, G-14/ASC models with high altitude engines, to which the G-10 had practically identical performance at both low and high altitudes, the spring 1944 date is correct.

Forgot to mention, as according to Prien/Rodeike`s Bf 109 F/G/K book.

Tilt · « **Reply #3 on:** November 10, 2003, 06:36:18 AM »

Whilst peddling detail it would be valid to state that the 3 cannon La7 did not enter frontline service until late February /early March (at best) 1945.

gatt · « **Reply #4 on:** November 10, 2003, 08:13:08 AM »

C.205: 1/43 is the first series only (2x7,7mm + 2X12,7mm). The third (cannon) series (2x12,7 and 2x20mm) is better placed between spring and summer '43.

F4UDOA · « **Reply #5 on:** November 10, 2003, 09:15:57 AM »

In regard to the F4U-4.

It actually was delivered in quanity in January 1945. In was produced in limited quanity before then. I actually have a pilots manual for the F4U-4 dated Oct 1944.

Karnak · « **Reply #6 on:** November 11, 2003, 01:09:52 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by VO101_Isegrim
However, if for game purposes the G-10 also represents the Bf 109 G-6/AS, G-6/ASM, G-14/AS, G-14/ASM, G-14/ASC models with high altitude engines, to which the G-10 had practically identical performance at both low and high altitudes, the spring 1944 date is correct.

I do not believe that the Bf109G-10 as modeled in AH (451mph) matches the performance of the Bf109G-6/AS or Bf109G-14 (~425mph, IIRC).

Re: N1K2-J. I would put the combat debut of the N1K2-J in 1-45 now. They may have delivered some in 1944, but I can find no indication that it saw combat until 1-45.

FUNKED1 · « **Reply #7 on:** November 11, 2003, 02:02:56 AM »

I can't believe how anal I used to be.

Batz · « **Reply #8 on:** November 11, 2003, 02:21:49 AM »

from being anal to meat gazin'... anyone see the pattern?

dankes · « **Reply #9 on:** November 11, 2003, 02:23:29 AM »

LA 7
24 June 44 1st service appearance of 2 ShVAK LA-7. 176 GvIAP

LA 7 armed with 3 B-20 seems entered the service Feb - Nov (sic!) 45 due to regular cannon malfunction.

Yak9U

Trials finished 20 Apr 44, combat trials summer 44 163 IAP

Sarge1 · « **Reply #10 on:** November 12, 2003, 04:38:14 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by dankes
LA 7 armed with 3 B-20 seems entered the service Feb - Nov (sic!) 45 due to regular cannon malfunctions

if that is right 45 in svc it shouldnt really be in here since Europe was over in Mar 45 couldnt of seen much action in that part of the world . dont remember of many russians in japan area.. the B29 seen more service than that LA 7 then our la7 should be the two gun La 7 and bring on the B29.. good excuse to ask for that....lol