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Offline straffo

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« Reply #120 on: November 19, 2003, 01:48:46 PM »
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Originally posted by gofaster

What did we care about a war in Europe in 1914?
What did we care about a war in Europe in 1939?  


it wasn't 1914 ... and it wasn't 1939 either.

btw it was smart in 1939 US army was well ... risible ?
« Last Edit: November 19, 2003, 01:52:03 PM by straffo »
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Offline Rude

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« Reply #121 on: November 19, 2003, 01:50:18 PM »
You're wasting your time Iron.
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Offline crabofix

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« Reply #122 on: November 19, 2003, 01:54:23 PM »
Hey, Straffo, how come you´re not "probated"?

Dont you wanna be in the squad?
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Offline straffo

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« Reply #123 on: November 19, 2003, 01:55:56 PM »
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Originally posted by gofaster
A declaration of war is the formality.  The act of aggression is the cause.  Serbia caused the war by assassinating Archduke Ferdinand.
 


I allways thought  Austria wrote the ultimatum ...
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Offline gofaster

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« Reply #124 on: November 19, 2003, 01:57:03 PM »
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Originally posted by GScholz

Liberation of Kuwait: 1991

Attack on USS Cole: 2000

I think they would agree.

 


Doh! Yeah, you're right.  That's what I get for trying to multi-task during a political discussion.

December 4, 1992, President Bush (the first one) sent US troops into Somalia to support the UN humanitarian aid effort there.  The US was there as part of the UN peacekeeping force.  When the US pulled its troops out of Somalia in 1994, the UN humanitarian aid effort was doomed.  It ended  in 1995.  As luck would have it, Aidid died later that same year from bullet wounds.

So really, what you're saying is that the US should avoid getting involved in UN affairs and simply let the countries work it out for themselves?  Much like Lebanon and Somalia have?
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Offline Martlet

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« Reply #125 on: November 19, 2003, 01:59:05 PM »
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Originally posted by GScholz
Ramzey, Martlet is a very, very, very misinformed individual. He is also very stubborn and cynical (in a borderline fascist way). To argue with individuals like him is a waste of time.


Inform me then, oh wise one.
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Offline gofaster

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« Reply #126 on: November 19, 2003, 02:00:43 PM »
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Originally posted by straffo
it wasn't 1914  


The casualty tables say it was 1914.

http://www.worldwar1.com/tlcrates.htm

So does the BBC
« Last Edit: November 19, 2003, 02:03:24 PM by gofaster »
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Offline gofaster

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« Reply #127 on: November 19, 2003, 02:04:53 PM »
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Originally posted by straffo
I allways thought  Austria wrote the ultimatum ...


Austria didn't assassinate a political figure.
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Offline straffo

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« Reply #128 on: November 19, 2003, 02:12:25 PM »
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Originally posted by gofaster
Austria didn't assassinate a political figure.


Neither did the serb ,it was a bosnian student a area anexed by the Austrian in 1908.

so technicaly it was on Austria soil , btw they were interogated (I guess with all the love the Austrian had for their local monority) they implicate serbia.



IMO the real responsible for WWI is Nicolas II but it's my opinion nothing more.


And it was not a political figure , juts yetanotherroyaltard .


About 1914 part look like I mis-understood your post I thought you implied the US intervention started in 1914 which is wrong.
« Last Edit: November 19, 2003, 02:18:23 PM by straffo »
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Offline gofaster

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« Reply #129 on: November 19, 2003, 02:15:59 PM »
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Originally posted by GScholz
The thing with the UN is that it is not a country, it's an international organization. There are clear sets of rules and guidelines for what the UN can and cannot do. The UN effort in Somalia was not to wage war on the warlords there. The UN was there solely as a humanitarian effort (much like Bosnia), the military forces (peacekeepers) were there to protect the UN and independent (red cross etc.) aid workers. The US forces that did fight the warlords (like depicted in Black Hawk Down for instance) were not part of the UN force. The UN cannot intervene in a civil war. The UN cannot interfere in the internal matters of a nation. The UN is neutral, and that's why it was the best tool we had for peace. If the participants of a war do not want peace, then peace cannot be obtained. In Bosnia only the Bosnian-Muslims wanted us there, so we were not in Bosnian-Serb territories. Our only mission was to protect the aid convoys and render aid to the civilians.

The US military was there as part of the UN effort, according to this.  The specific "Black Hawk Down" incident was part of a UN sweep.  The US forces were there as part of the UN request for troops to protect the aid segment of the UN mission.
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Offline AKIron

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« Reply #130 on: November 19, 2003, 02:16:26 PM »
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Originally posted by Rude
You're wasting your time Iron.


I refuse to believe those that have told me I argue for the sake of argument. I argue to win!

;)

Now you know how I came by my callsign, it is the density of my head. :D
« Last Edit: November 19, 2003, 02:22:53 PM by AKIron »
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Offline gofaster

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« Reply #131 on: November 19, 2003, 02:18:49 PM »
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Originally posted by GScholz
US troops in 1914? Where?


Exactly.  You proved my argument.  My point was, that US isolationism was going strong in 1914.  Had the US not waited to enter the war, it could've been decided much sooner.  See my earlier posting with all the pretty pictures.  US isolationism failed then, and it would fail now.
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Offline Elfie

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« Reply #132 on: November 19, 2003, 02:19:13 PM »
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Originally posted by crabofix
Yes the US did a great job, when helping libarating France.

No doubt about this.

But if they was so concerned about France as you say, why didnt they get involved earlier?

Why did it take a declaration of war from Germany?


Crabofix, you need to understand that the majority of Americans held an isolationist view. They didnt care that Europe was in yet another war. With that in mind, the government can't just jump into the war without causing all kinds of domestic problems.  Japan's attack on Pearl Harbor brought America together as nothing else could have.

Germany didn't declare war on us until after we declared war on Japan.
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Offline Jack55

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« Reply #133 on: November 19, 2003, 02:31:38 PM »
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Originally posted by straffo
I allways thought  Austria wrote the ultimatum ...


They wanted free hand to capture and prosecute the revolutionaries hiding inside Serbia that assassinated the Arch-Duke.  No nation would give up their self respect and independance in such a manner.  They knew it would come to war and were afraid Russia would come to aid Serbia because of their relegious and culteral similarities.  So they waited and lobbied Germany for support if Russia interviened. This resulted in rising tensions and escolating mobilizations among the opposing power blocks.  I don't think Serbia was successfully conquered during WW1.  It became unimportant in light of the mass carnage.
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Offline mrblack

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« Reply #134 on: November 19, 2003, 02:43:00 PM »
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Originally posted by bigsky
they wouldnt get ambushed if they were doing proper recon and have infantry ahead and the sides of the convoys. that would stop the ambushes cold, but they couldnt go speeding around at 50mph. i dont know what there teaching those soldiers these days.
http://www.sftt.org/cgi-bin/csNews/csNews.cgi?database=Hacks%20Target.db&command=viewone&op=t&id=27&rnd=931.3696268965701


Great more armchair generals:rolleyes:
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