Asst.

[TT]

 We have all had the experiance of sawing the wing off what appeared to be a perfectly good airplane, only to find that all we got for are ammo was an assist. I suggest we start counting asst. as kills. It would remove the bad taste from our mouths from kissing our sisters. and we would start seeing a lot more bialing than ditching. More kills for everybody .

[Nash]

I dunno how many times I've sawed off both wings and the entire tail section of plane only to get an assist (the kill going to someone who by now is far far away). My understanding is that the kill goes to the person who did the most damage. How can ya possibly damage the plane more than this? Drives me crazy and I'm sure I'm not alone.

I'd also like to see the kills awarded to both planes (or neither?) in mutual death situations such as HO's. Seems odd that the scoring doesn't reflect that a plane gets killed by you just because it happens to hit the dirt a few seconds after you do. Now that I think about it, having nobody get the kill would thwart the HO's a little bit around here -  a good thing imho (please don't hunt me down for saying this WD! <g> )

But ah... Killer game this AH. Haven't said it yet. I'm absolutely addicted.

[Nash]

Oh one more thing. I think it would be interesting if you could enter TWO pilot's handles on the kill stats page, and see how many times they have killed you compared to the amount you have killed them. Even to get some kinda ranked list to see who's the guy that's made yer life the most miserable around here - and also who's the poor sap that has made it all bearable  

[leonid]

Well, in the Soviet Union during WWII, there were two types of air victories(they didn't use the word 'kill'), personal and shared, or group.  In the USAAF, kills would be split up into fractions.  I don't know how the Germans or Brits or any other country did it, but they all seemed to grade a solo-effort kill the highest.

So, it really comes down to semantics.  It could be called an assist, a group victory, or even some fraction of a kill, but it will still boil down to less points than a full, personal kill.

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129 IAP VVS RKKA

[-kier-]

Nash-

This is already in place. Go to the scores page and set the proper filters.

TT-

This is why I wouldn't pay too much attention to the scores (outside of making anecdotal observations). It's fun to look at them and see how particular aircraft fair vs. one another (as Leonid and Vermillion have done). I have looked at them to see the impact of participating in different elements of the game (ever see what one buff sortie can do to your score?).

If you let one person swooping in to "steal" your kill ruin this sim for you, you won't play very long. I want to see my name in lights (at least, on the left side of the buffer), but people will steal kills. Furthermore, many times I have been downed by a plane I assumed was dead, because my FE saw his plane lose a wing. I don't take any chances now. I saw on them until they disappear or I see a chute. If someone wants to zoom behind me and take sloppy-seconds, that's ok. The bad guy is dead, I know I beat him, and I go look for someone else.  

From an historical standpoint, the reason you wouldn't give everyone a kill is because it would inflate the actual number of enemy destroyed, leading a country to make some false assumptions of the strength of their enemy.  

[Dhog]

This ought to stir things up a bit... as a concession to realism how about requiring visual confirmation of a kill by a friendly? No kills awarded unless verified by "eyes-on" of your wingy or other friendly. Kills can only be awarded after landing and "verified" by a keyboard action. Now in the interest of those flying alone, there would be a command (.verify) that would query the server as to whether a friendly plane had been close enough to see the action.
This has several positive effects. One is that "landing a kill" becomes imperative. Second, the value of kills increases and becomes a bit rarer. Thirdly, encourages mutual support.

Dhog out

[NiteF1yr]

I can't be absolutely sure on this because I didn't have the chance to fly a lot last night but in one instance I got my first kill after I was already dead. I commented on this on the open channel but got no replies. I ended up in a situation where the enemy and I mutually killed each other. I was killed first but there was no doubt I had inflicted enough damage to kill him as well. The message buffer read that I had been killed and then came up that I had killed him. This was the first time I received a kill after I was already declared dead. Perhaps the scoring has been tweaked.

I don't mind the idea of kills and assists even though sometimes you have to wonder about getting an assist with the amount of lead you just pumped into a plane to kill it. If it took that much to kill it and I only get an assist on it what did the other guy do to get the kill. I'm sure there are plenty of times when an attacker shoots up a plane but does not down it. You come along and take off his wing not realizing his wing was only hanging on by a thread. Other times even though the original attacker on me did not down me he disabled me enough so that someone else could come along and easily finish the job so the first guy gets the kill and the second guy gets the assist as it should be. I wonder who gets the kill if the damage inflicted by 2 attackers is 50/50?

Just my thoughts on the situation.

Nite

[Hristo]

Use 30 mm, the ultimate kill stealer !!

When I used it in 109, all it took was one ping. Many times enemy went down, kill stealers went after him and shot him all the way, but the kill was always mine  

Once I saw La that was gang banged by fellow rooks. I pinged him with 30 mm, he still flew after, but at the end kill was mine, they got assists.

[juzz]

Mmmm - you can get 2x30mm in the Fw190 with more ammo and the usual 2x20mm + 2x13mm. Have to try that one out.  

[Wardog]

TT

Kills alone dont do much in the rankings,it a combination of fighter kills & bombing damage.. And you dont need to fly a b17..

The next time you at an enemy field & ack is down. Straffe ammo,fuel,barracks and see how this changes your ranking..

[TT]

Thx for the tip WD. I dont really care all that much about the score. When we get exoplosions a lot of this will change anyway. I do think this idea might send the game into an interesting direction though. A lot of times I let a con go, thinking that the other guy has got the kill. Then the con ditch,s and nobody gets the kill. On a team level, if everybody that pinged him got a kill message, they would all be trying to wack the bad guy, all the time. Which I suspect is how it really was in the war.

[This message has been edited by TT (edited 12-10-1999).]

[Swager]

Kills!  Assist!  What difference does it make!  


As long as the bastard's DEAD!!!!

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Damn Ghostrider!  This bogey is all over me!!

[rosco-]

ROFL swager, Im with you  

[TT]

 Swager/ I think the reason most of us prefer online sims to boxed. Is that it makes no differance how good you get at a boxed sim, nobody knows it except you. I think the people that play multi player games have a desire to camunicate on different levels. If you get an asst. its the same as a boxed sim. Nobody knows it but you. How many times have you seen in the buffer" I got an asst. on that one". These players are expressing that desire.

 Not getting a kill message if you die first has the same effect. People are constantly asking "did I get you". Ego,s aside, we want that instant feedback. And we feel a need to share this info whith the other players.

[Thunder]

Hmmmm guess I play for another reason. I play online sims because the opponent is a live "desision maker" and I can't ever be sure what they will do. I personally love the whining too! When did you ever have a box sim come back on open chanel and  say "You caught me when I was typing!" Or maybe "They are stealing our sheep and women... Save thhe sheep!" Lastly, I never have made a freindship wil a box sim pilot or felt that any box sim pilot was a dweeb! For me its the "Real Life" dynamics that has the draw!

Thunder