Author Topic: pics of dhl jet (Read 1462 times)

straffo · « **Reply #30 on:** December 10, 2003, 02:31:45 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Saurdaukar
Looks like your boys hit it pretty good Straffo!

What ?
Do you want me to troll about this again ?
tss tss ... lack of context here

Quote

Originally posted by _Schadenfreude_
my bad - should rephrase - I see those pesky Europeans make some pretty tough birdsat their French factory!!

So far it can be yours also ,before leaving Airbus the brit were working on the wing (or engine) if I'm not mistaken.
And Airbus is not French btw

Saurdaukar · « **Reply #31 on:** December 10, 2003, 02:36:24 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by straffo
What ?
Do you want me to troll about this again ?
tss tss ... lack of context here

Just congratulating you and your cause for pulling off such a brave and well considered attack! Bravo!

straffo · « **Reply #32 on:** December 10, 2003, 02:43:06 PM »

_Shadenfreude_ I checked my doc. it's Hawker Siddeley wich made the wing, and the engine were either Pratt & Whitney JT-9D or GE CF6.

_Schadenfreude_ · « **Reply #33 on:** December 10, 2003, 04:05:58 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by straffo
_Shadenfreude_ I checked my doc. it's Hawker Siddeley wich made the wing, and the engine were either Pratt & Whitney JT-9D or GE CF6.

Damn, I could see everyone getting into a major froth if it was French.....

straffo · « **Reply #34 on:** December 10, 2003, 04:13:00 PM »

hehe

Warning when writing that "French" word you'll have to use the lowest font size otherwise you take the risk of waking-up some "Deep Ones" or "Cthulhu" himself

jigsaw · « **Reply #35 on:** December 11, 2003, 02:40:43 PM »

Quote

Baghdad Airbus Landed Without Hydraulics?
Company officials won't confirm it but, if it's true, the missile attack on a DHL Airbus last month in Baghdad is one hell of a flying story. Shortly after the incident, AVweb received word that the missile knocked out all three hydraulics systems on the A300 and the unidentified crew had to make the emergency landing using only differential thrust for directional control. DHL has steadfastly refused to confirm the story. In an e-mail to AVweb Wednesday, company spokesman Claus Korfmacher said he wouldn't comment until all the various investigations were completed. "Unfortunately, the situation hasn't changed," said Korfmacher. "Investigations are still ongoing therefore we cannot provide any additional information. This applies for our flight crew members as well." According to an Aviation Week and Space Technology story, an unnamed source said the Airbus lost hydraulics about a minute after the missile hit. The source also said the pilot of the Airbus had recently attended a seminar in which one of the speakers was retired United Air Lines Captain Al Haynes. He was the pilot who crash landed a DC-10 at Sioux City, Iowa, in 1989 on engine thrust alone after an engine failure took out his aircraft's hydraulics (see AVweb's interview with Haynes). Aviation Week quotes the Belgian Cockpit Association Secretary General Pierre Ghyoot as saying the organization is planning to give an award to the DHL pilots.

So... according to this they did lose all 3 systems.

Link to full AVWeb issue is http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/163-full.html

mora · « **Reply #36 on:** December 11, 2003, 04:27:32 PM »

I guess we'll have to wait for the final report for confirmation. If it did lose all hydraulics this is going to be the most amazing flying story ever by a wide margin. The cvr transcript will be interesting to read, they might even release the actual recording as all went well.

MotorOil · « **Reply #37 on:** December 11, 2003, 05:29:10 PM »

Has anyone seen my SA7 missles? They seem to have gone missing?

mjolnir · « **Reply #38 on:** December 11, 2003, 06:38:03 PM »

I'll admit up front that I know nothing of A300 construction, but don't most planes usually have the wheel brakes on a completely independent system from the rest of the hydraulic components?

FUNKED1 · « **Reply #39 on:** December 11, 2003, 06:48:21 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by mjolnir
I'll admit up front that I know nothing of A300 construction, but don't most planes usually have the wheel brakes on a completely independent system from the rest of the hydraulic components?

Yes

Also, the flight control system may be able to handle failure modes where only engine thrust is available. I'm not sure how it works on each Airbus model but I know that the newest ones have control algorithms which adapt to different failure modes and use all available means to carry out the pilot's flight control inputs via yoke and rudder. If that is how this plane landed then it would be an unprecedented triumph for Airbus engineers and would be a vindication of their oft-maligned reliance on automation.

mora · « **Reply #40 on:** December 11, 2003, 06:56:07 PM »

I googled this up:
http://www.chipsplace.com/helpful/Airbus/Hydraulics.htm
It's about A320 but I believe the hydraulics are quite similar.

"Green system – 1 pump: engine driven. Two power sources: engine 1 pump & PTU

Blue system – 2 pumps: 1 electric and the emergency RAT. Two sources of power: electric pump & RAT pump.

Yellow system – 3 pumps: 1 engine, 1 electric & 1 hand pump. 4 sources of power: engine 2 pump, electric pump, hand pump and PTU.

Green is the “heavy” system with landing gear, flaps/slats, N/W STRG and Normal Brakes.

Blue is basically for redundancy with the only unique items on it being L & R spoiler 3 and the Emergency Generator which are “backup” items themselves.

The alternate brakes are powered by the Yellow hydraulic system and will automatically become selected if Green hydraulic is insufficient for normal brakes. Yellow brakes have the same capabilities as normal brakes except for autobrake capability."

So it appears that the brakes are powered by 2 of the hydraulic systems.

I know I have too much time on my hands...

FUNKED1 · « **Reply #41 on:** December 11, 2003, 06:59:42 PM »

Weird, no mention of primary flight controls on any of those circuits. Is Airbus using electric actuators for primaries? Or is that info wrong?

mora · « **Reply #42 on:** December 11, 2003, 07:00:40 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by FUNKED1
Yes

Also, the flight control system may be able to handle failure modes where only engine thrust is available. I'm not sure how it works on each Airbus model but I know that the newest ones have control algorithms which adapt to different failure modes and use all available means to carry out the pilot's flight control inputs via yoke and rudder. If that is how this plane landed then it would be an unprecedented triumph for Airbus engineers and would be a vindication of their oft-maligned reliance on automation.

I remember reading that it was developed by NASA after Sioux City. It was implied on the MD-11 but no other planes to my knowledge(not sure about this). DC-10 series planes have the advantage of the tail engine which can be used to control horizontal axis aswell.

Edit: Info about flight controls is here: http://www.chipsplace.com/helpful/Airbus/Flight%20Controls.htm#FlightControls
Index: http://www.chipsplace.com/helpful/Airbus/Airbus320TOC.htm#TOC

Edit#2 A320 has FBW flight controls unlike A300 which is traditional '70s tech.

FUNKED1 · « **Reply #43 on:** December 11, 2003, 07:06:00 PM »

Actually the DC-10 incident was caused by uncontained failure of the center engine. They only had the wing engines to work with.

FUNKED1 · « **Reply #44 on:** December 11, 2003, 07:11:05 PM »

See if you can find a manual for an A300 (the type involved in Bagdhad). Between Creamo and Toad and I we can figure out what the deal is.
Full designation: A300B4-203F