This is kinda confusing.

[Lizking]

It is useless to argue with his Ilk, because they will never acknowledge facts or accept reality.

You were there?  I salute you!  Relevancy to this thread? 0%

[Thrawn]

Originally posted by Toad
I mean, you can't do stuff like that if you're being inspected right? No way, no how. The inspectors would easily find it, right?

No, not necessarily.  And the implicate comparison to the UNMOVIC inpections in Iraq is unfair.  The two programs were different in intent as well as size.  I find it interesting though that you are taking Kadaffi's word at face value though.

And it certainly isn't really to surprising a move and no it's some sort of intant turn around for him.  Kadaffi's being trying to turn around western opinion on him and his government for quite awhile now.  An example is his desire to pay compensation to families that had members die do to Libyan sponsered terrorism.  The seat Africa voted Libya to have on the Human Rights Council.  And his attempts to help tyr and form a United States of Africa.  

This is certainly a fantastic gesture, but I wonder how much of it is just gesture.


To assume because the UN was wrong about Libya it was wrong about Iraq is pretty silly as well.  Once again totally different operations.


As fair as the UN Scurity Council being cowards.  There's a couple of ways you could look at it.  One that they were cowards because they didn't invade Iraq.  One wonders what they could so afraid of, especially after seeing the pasting Iraq got in the Gulf war.

Another way is to see as courage for not kow-towing to the US government, it's bribes, or it's blackmail.  Especially in light of the manufactured "evidence" poor old Powel had to present to the UN.


The UN is corrupt.  Well it must be, some Cambodians sure apparently thought so three decades ago.  That's called a fallacy of biased sample.  Sure there are problably corrupt people in it, as was said earlier, huge organisation, it wouldn't be surprising.  But to then somehow conclude that it's deep systemic problem with no evidence is poor reasoning.


But just remember, the US went to war too stop Libya from making WMD, no wait, it was for Iraqi freedom, no wait, it to stop SH's WMD program.  Whatever else, it wasn't because the Bush administration told you and your elected representitives that Iraqi WMDs were an immediate to the US.  

[GRUNHERZ]

Somebody quote me on this so Gscholz sees it. I wouldnt care too much except that he mentioned me by name.

Gsholz I never blamed you for srebrenica, you are not Dutch UN betrayer and murderer of civilans.

[Creamo]

Originally posted by GRUNHERZ
Somebody quote me on this so Gscholz sees it. I wouldnt care too much except that he mentioned me by name.

Gsholz I never blamed you for srebrenica, you are not Dutch UN betrayer and murderer of civilans.

The Raiders suck.

ok

[GRUNHERZ]

Yes this year the raiders particularly suck...

[Toad]

The implication is that UN arms inspections are obviously totally dependent on the willingness of the country in question to cooperate.

[Ping]

Thrawn summed up Libya's actions quite nicely.
Is libya doing this because of fear of Americas actions, undoubtedly so. I perceive that this is directly related to what I perceive to have been a policy of containment and limited strikes imposed against Libya by the US for Years.
 In that case there was a definite link to terrorist activities and training camps.
 Khaddafy has been wanting to rejoin the world community for some time now and as a result is willing to turn his back on his evil ways.

 Of course not knowing him personaly I have no way of telling if he is legit.

[Ping]

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ly.html

Libyan military adventures failed, e.g., the prolonged foray of Libyan troops into the Aozou Strip in northern Chad was finally repulsed in 1987. Libyan support for terrorism decreased after UN sanctions were imposed in 1992. Those sanctions were suspended in April 1999.

 Ouch. Kinda says something about UN sanctions eh?

[Maverick]

I realize that this is going in another direction on this globe here but about the UN's ability to get something, anything done about WMD's.

What about the North Korean's taking out the inspecters cameras and publicly announcing they are starting up their nuclear program? If the UN was a real global cop instead of a paper tiger I think they would have done something other than turn and walk away from the situation and wait for the US to take some kind of action.

[JBA]

Originally posted by GScholz
That's a rather harsh accusation. Do you have anything to back it up with?

Maybe not full corruption. But it does stink like it. Looks like they didn't want to bite the hand that feeds it.


Since late 1999, there has been no limit on oil exports. Over nearly six years, more than $50 billion has flowed into the relevant U.N. accounts. There is a formula for how it should flow out into delineated sectors in Iraq, such as education, health, electricity, and agriculture. Fifty-nine percent of the revenue goes to humanitarian goods for south and central Iraq, and is administered directly by the regime in Baghdad. Thirteen percent goes to the three governates of the ostensibly autonomous no-fly zone in the north, known as Iraqi Kurdistan.A little over 2 percent goes to covering the administrative overhead for the 10 U.N. agencies involved  . Most of the remainder goes to Kuwait as compensation for the Persian Gulf War. Plug in the numbers, and the riches become embarrassing: There is upwards of $1 billion just to cover the agencies' overhead over these six years. Less than 40 percent of the money designated for Iraqi Kurdistan has been used, and therefore some $4 billion is gathering interest -- and, presumably, dust -- at the Banque Nationale de Paris in New York City while thousands of families are suffering needlessly.


http://www.iraqfoundation.org/news/2002/joct/7_audit.html

[Mini D]

Originally posted by StSanta
Well, I can't speak for others. I can onyl say that I'm enjoying the side effect of the war very much. it's nice to see dictators and tyrants grovel outta fear

Interesting that you'd call this a side effect.

MiniD

[Rude]

Originally posted by Mini D
Interesting that you'd call this a side effect.

MiniD

and what would you term it as?

[midnight Target]

Originally posted by Toad
The implication is that UN arms inspections are obviously totally dependent on the willingness of the country in question to cooperate.

Let's consider the logic of the above statement...

Unless you are willing to give the UN the authority to use force whenever THEY feel it is necessary this statement will always be true. For example:

Cop wants to pull you over for speeding you don't wanna stop... what makes you stop? The cop's authority to enforce the law.

So on the one hand we complain that the UN is a bunch of wimps, while on the other hand we really don't want them to have the kind of autonomous authority necessary to enforce the sanctions. Can't have it both ways.

[Toad]

So you agree with the statement then?

Come on, come on... step right in there.

[midnight Target]

Isn't that what I said? (in a politically side stepping sort of way)