PT BOATS SHOULDN'T SPAWN FROM FLEETS; WE NEED LSTs!

[MRPLUTO]

PT boats were not found escorting fleets.  PT boats should only be available at ports or coastal fields.  [Some others have pointed out that PT boats didn't need much in the way of port facilities.]  What should spawn from fleets are LSTs (Landing Ship, Tank), which could make their way to a beach, open their bow doors, and disgorge some GVs.

/S/MRPLUTO, VMF-323, ~Death Rattlers~



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[snafu]

Hi MRPLUTO,
 Of course what you (and others) have said is historically correct. But PT boats spawn around fleets because of the same reasons that osties etc turn up at enemy fields (wasn't the ostie primarily a defence tool in real life)? the percentage of tools available to AH players is very small in comparision to what was really available so people will always find new uses for what we have. In WWII the fleet would never be sent into some of the situations we put ours into. The big problem (At least from a land based assault point of view) is we have no infantary, - and I'm not suggesting we should either. The "AH war" is fought completely using vehicles whether they be land , sea or air based. Because of this we use other methods of attack or defence. In WWII people were in the battle for the duration in AH people drift in and out all the time a quick way of going on the offensive (or putting up a formidable defence) needs to be available. The PT boat spawning for fleet defence is no different to the M3 etc being able to spawn in sight of a smoking field.

Like I said, I agree with you 100% but in my opinion the gameplay would suffer if certain realism aspects were forced on us without the complete toolkit being available.

But YES bring on the Landing craft   The current terrain & spawn points have really killed the land war

TTFN
snafu

[Westy]

 You'll need PT boats to escort the LVT's. You won't have the same amout of air cover or shore bombardment that real landings had. So learn how to kill PT boats just like one had to learn to kill the M16s, Osties and Panzers.

 -Westy

[SKurj]

Sigh...

Some people who post here really should read the news!! +)

The LVT is coming in the future, and then of course you'll be glad you have PT's..

AKskurj

[snafu]

Yes and lets hope the LVT's get more support than some of the Goony missions I've been on.  

TTFN
snafu

[Frosty1]

LSD is a drug, hehe.

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===>Frosty
====>Exposure2k.com
=====>Frosty@exposure2k.com

[Westy]

"lets hope the LVT's get more support than some of the Goony missions"

 One thing HTC can't model is co-operation.
But I'd bet that it wouldn't be much of a problem seeing how much the Naval aspect is drawing folks to the CV's.

-Westy

[Hans]

And LSD is also known as Landing Ship Dock, Frosty.

Kind of like our modern day assault ships.  A large ship that can flood ballast tanks and landing craft can float out and in picking up more supplies and men to put ashore.

I beleave they used some LSDs as bases for patrol boats too.  PTs don't have the range to travel all the way across the Pacific, so they are transported there in LSDs.

Hans.

[LePaul]

Good point on cooperation.  All of this boat stuff has really drawn folks away from the bombers and goons.  I was on Knights last night and the team kept yelling for a goon, some poor soul would bring one, only to be vulched by fighters.  Towards the end of the evening, that pilot siad "No more goons for me, you're on your own".  And I completely agree with him...I'd been blown up 3 times trying to haul a goon to a requestest spot.

Its one thing to beg the mailman to bring you mail, but if he can't get through the 4 feet of snow and rotweillers on the porch......  

Paul

[MRPLUTO]

Skurj, I have read the news, which is why I wrote what I did: hoping that when LSTs/LVTs get here, that PT boats will be put in their proper place.  

PT boats should be spawning from any base on a coast, and would be deployed to meet an invasion fleet.  The first target of the invading force will be any VHs, FHs, or BHs at the invasion site.  Now the ground opposition is limited to whatever GVs and PT boats spawned before the VH was destroyed.  Use your fighter/bombers & naval guns to destroy them, and your LVTs won't need PT boats of their own to protect them. [Note: Air superiority must be acheived before the order to storm the beach is given.]  I expect it will take LVTs 5-15 minutes to arrive (depends on how close the Task Force is to the beach), so the order to go must not be made before the beach has been "softened up" quite a bit.

I like the idea of forcing the air & sea forces to cooperate in realistic ways.  LePaul is right, it's a minor outrage how, just as the C-47s come in, the air force loses interest.  I hope the same won't happen when we start launching amphibious invasions.  As the landing craft make their way to the beach, fighter bombers should be pounding it, swooping in low to look for GVs hiding under the smoke and sinking any remaining enemy PT boats.  And if anyone can hit anything with the fleets guns, then they should open up too.

Also, I don't think PT boats will be too effective against tanks & Osties waiting on the beach.  In my experience, the GVs clobber the PT boats whenever they get fairly close.  Historically, I believe that PT boats were pretty much a failure, except at public relations. They were not made to cross long distances of open ocean, and were made of wood, so sending them into a beach head would have been suicidal.  They were Patrol Torpedo boats, made to secure coastlines and meet any enemy invasion force and harrass it.  But they were really too fragile to go against all but weak opposition.  In fact, I don't think they sank much of anything during the war.

/S/ MRPLUTO, VMF-323, ~Death Rattlers~

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[LtReiben]

While scrolling through the ever growing list of topics, I came across this one and decided something should be said in the PT Boats defense. when speaking from a gaming stand point, the PT Boat has little place in AH. All but the C-47 and M3 are vehicles designed specifically for destroying one another making the PT boat an easy target. MRPLUTO is right about PT boats and their effectiveness against Tanks & Ostwinds they will most likely make easy targets. but that's because they weren't meant to kill Mobile AA and Armour they were designed in real life to sink ships... and the AH PTs are no different. Its MRPLUTOs Opinion on the PT Boats Historical value that I strongly disagree with. PTs were not a failure and they sank a lot of Strategic targets along with some tactical ones when necessary.

PTs are relatively useless in AH , but that's because a lot of the PT Boats tasks are non-existent in AH. PTs in the Pacific sank Subs with depth charges, would lay minefields, assisted in commando raids, rescuing of downed pilots, Harbor Surveys, escorting and laying of smokescreens. The Japanese feared that PT boat, its speed and small size made it a difficult target. PT boats were usually hiding in the day, then carried out surprise attacks at night earning them the name "Green Dragon" from the Japanese. its said that one PT sank a total of 18,400 tons while operating in the pacific. To make an already long story short. the PT boat is a nice addition to AH, it is out of place, and will be the less effective way of doing things unless it can fight at night(votes for night in AH). but Historically the PT boat was a highly useful and effective instrument of war.

[SKurj]

as a further to that Reiben...

Remove the PT's ability to spawn from carriers and it will lose another role it will be well suited to:  escorting the LVT's..

AKskurj

[LePaul]

Personally, while I find the PT a blast to play, they are essentially a water-bound kamikazie.  I know I get as close as I can, dump the torpedos and try to fend off the enmey fire from PTs, aicraft and ships.

Please note I've never asked how to re-arm a PT since I've never surived that long  

I'm just waiting for fun things to appear in the water.  We had sheep on land, I'm betting shark fins are just a patch away  

Paul

[715]

 

Originally posted by LePaul:
I'm just waiting for fun things to appear in the water.  We had sheep on land, I'm betting shark fins are just a patch away  

Paul

Warbirds used to have a single Godzilla in the water between two remote islands.  However, I think the sheep are not just a whimsy- they serve the purpose of texture for altitude awareness.  On the new AH sea that purpose is served by white caps.

Some people who post here really should read the news!! +)  The LVT is coming in the future, and then of course you'll be glad you have PT's..
[/b]

Yikes.  LVTs are coming?  You mean as a C47 pilot I am now going to be expected to drive what amounts to a big bathtub, at 3 mph, towards a field, under withering Ostie and C-hog fire?  

715

[LePaul]

Well, 715, you can play the "Love Boat" theme while you'e chugging to shore  

Paul