explain this to me

[Furious]

I guess the question is, do you want a free and open society where the populous has a right to know what its government is doing (providing, of course, for operational security), or a socialist society where the government controls what it wants its people to hear?

[StabbyTheIcePic]

Originally posted by Gunslinger
I would not AT ALL disagree to a congresional investigation.  I would completly disagree with congressional grandstanding and politicising this to promote political agenda.

How are they grandstanding to promote a political agenda? The most outspoken senators are 3 republicans. It seems like noone in the senate can do anything without you labeling a politcal agenda onto it.

[Saurdaukar]

Originally posted by StabbyTheIcePic
It seems like noone in the senate can do anything without you labeling a politcal agenda onto it.

ROFL!

[Chairboy]

Originally posted by Saurdaukar
Chairboy, it sounds as though you are more concerend with the political fallout on a global scale.  Understandably so, of course, as I suppose world opinion is something we should give thought to now and again, but all kidding aside, I'd be far more concerned with ensuring that something like this never happened again at the nuts and bolts level than whether or not the showboating illusion of 'investigation' was good enough for the fine people of Syria.

I agree that the problem must be fixed, I think our disagreement comes in the definition of what 'fix' means.  Fixing this problem is a lot more then just preventing it from happening again.  If you blow a fuse in your car, replacing the fuse doesn't 'fix' the problem, it just addresses the symptom.  You still need to find out what caused the fuse to blow in the first place.

If we don't deal with the trust issues worldwide, we'll see another generation of America haters grow up.  Out of that generation, who knows how many attackers will be groomed to strike against our soil the way the 19 hijackers did on that terrible day 3 years ago?  

I'm a software quality assurance professional, and one of the basic tenents of our work is that a bug gets exponentially more expensive to fix as time passes.  If you fix it before you ship, the cost is negligible compared to fixing it in the field.  The same applies here, and if we don't 'fix this bug' as early as possible, the cost of dealing with it 'in the field' will be measured in the lives of killed US soldiers and civilians.

[Gunslinger]

Originally posted by StabbyTheIcePic
How are they grandstanding to promote a political agenda? The most outspoken senators are 3 republicans. It seems like noone in the senate can do anything without you labeling a politcal agenda onto it.

Calling for Rumsfeild to step down after they've done everything right during this IMO is politically motivated.  

And no its not just 3 republicans.....most of the democrat senators this morning seemed to me like they were digging for somthing that just wasnt there.

[StabbyTheIcePic]

Originally posted by Gunslinger
Calling for Rumsfeild to step down after they've done everything right during this IMO is politically motivated.  

And no its not just 3 republicans.....most of the democrat senators this morning seemed to me like they were digging for somthing that just wasnt there.

That is their job, to dig. If it isnt there good. How would you like them to investigate. Ask questions like "is everything doing okay mr general? Do you need more money?"

[Furious]

Originally posted by Gunslinger
...after they've done everything right during this...

You sure about that?

[Gunslinger]

Originally posted by Furious
You sure about that?

Do you have evidence otherwise?  They performed an extensive investigation after it was reported to the proper officials.  I watched the testimony this morning and it sounds plain and simple:  Rules were in place to prevent this.  Those rules were broken....people will be punished for it.

Stabby....I watched the hearing.  When you have them making statements of abuse outside the scope of the current investigation just to bring more bad stuff to the table it is neither productive nor helpfull to the current investigation.  They were mostly democrates....its not that they werent looking for proof or anything but they were grasping at straws and creating fiction to me at least

[StabbyTheIcePic]

Originally posted by Gunslinger
Do you have evidence otherwise?  They performed an extensive investigation after it was reported to the proper officials.  I watched the testimony this morning and it sounds plain and simple:  Rules were in place to prevent this.  Those rules were broken....people will be punished for it.

Stabby....I watched the hearing.  When you have them making statements of abuse outside the scope of the current investigation just to bring more bad stuff to the table it is neither productive nor helpfull to the current investigation.  They were mostly democrates....its not that they werent looking for proof or anything but they were grasping at straws and creating fiction to me at least

Sounds like you just do not like the fact that the military is being questioned. Congress is just doing its job.  Their job is to ask questions, to try and make sure everything is being brought up. Like i said before, would you rather them not ask so many questions?

[Gunslinger]

Originally posted by StabbyTheIcePic
Sounds like you just do not like the fact that the military is being questioned. Congress is just doing its job.  Their job is to ask questions, to try and make sure everything is being brought up. Like i said before, would you rather them not ask so many questions?

They can question the military all they want.  This is their job.  But I listen to some of their questions and to me it seems that they are moivated to ask these questions not to investigate but to tarnish.  That's what I have a problem with.

[StabbyTheIcePic]

Originally posted by Gunslinger
They can question the military all they want.  This is their job.  But I listen to some of their questions and to me it seems that they are moivated to ask these questions not to investigate but to tarnish.  That's what I have a problem with.

We both have our biases i guess. I do not see how the questions are tarnishing the military. Then again i do not have any undying support for them.

[Gunslinger]

Originally posted by StabbyTheIcePic
We both have our biases i guess. I do not see how the questions are tarnishing the military. Then again i do not have any undying support for them.

that is quite obvious