P-61

[Zanth]

Originally posted by Grits
We need more Japanese, Soviet, and Italian planes before any late war US stuff. Heck, we need the early P-38's and the P-39 variants before the P-61.

We may "need" more hangar queens - but it's nice to get something in the "want" column every now and then too

[Rafe35]

Originally posted by Grits
We need more Japanese, Soviet, and Italian planes before any late war US stuff. Heck, we need the early P-38's and the P-39 variants before the P-61.

P-38F or P-38J would be nice

[Arlo]

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[SpiveyCH]

Northrop P-61 Black Widow
P-61A, B, and C and F-15 (RF-61C) Reporter

Origin: Northrop Aircraft Inc. Hawthorne, California.

Type: (P-61) three-seat night fighter;  (F-15) two-seat stratgic reconnaissance.

Engines:  Two Pratt & Whitney R-2800 Double Wasp 18-cylinder two-row radials;  (P-61A) 2,000hp R-2800-10; (B) 2,000hp R-2800-65; (C and F-15) 2,800hp (wet rating) R-2800-73.

Dimensions:  Span 66ft (20-12m); length (A) 48ft 11in (14-92cm); (B, C) 49ft 7in (15-1m); (F-15) 50ft 3in (15-3m); height (typical) 14ft 8in (4-49m)

Weights:  Empty (typical P-61) 24,000lb (10,866kg);  (F-15) 22,000lb (9979kg); maximum loaded (A) 32,400lb (14,696kg);  (B) 38,000lb (17,237kg);  (C) 40,300lb (18,280kg);  (F-15, clean) 28,000lb (12,700kg).

Performance:  maximum speed (A, B) 366mph (590km/h);  (C) 230mph (692km/h);  (F-15) 440mph (708km/h);  initial climb (A, B) 2,200ft (670m)/min;  (C, F-15) 3,00ft (914m)/min;  service ceiling (A, B) 33,000ft (10,060m);  (C, F-15) 41,000ft (12,500m);  range with maximum fuel (A) 500 miles;  (B, C) 2,800 miles (4500km);  (F-15) 4,000 miles (6440km).

Armament:  Four Fixed 20mm M-2 cannon in belly, firing ahead (plus, in first 37 A, last 250 B and all C) electric dorsal turret with four 0-5in remotley controlled from or rear sight station and fired by pilot;  (B and C) underwing racks for 6,400lb load;  (F-15A) no armament.

History:  First flight (XP-61) 21 May 1942;  service delivery (A) May 1944; first flight (F-15A 1946.

User:  USA (AFF)

Development:  The first aircraft ever order to be designed explicitly as a night fighter, the XP-61 prototypes were ordered in January 1941 on the basis of combat reports from the early radar-equipped fighters of the RAF.  A very big aircraft, the P-61 had the new SCR-720 AI radar in the nose, the armament being mounted well back above and below the rather lumpy nacelle housing pilot, radar operator and gunner with front and rear sighting stations.  The broad wing had almost full-span double-slotted flaps, very small ailerons and lateral-control spoilers in an arrangement years ahead of its time.  Black-painted (hence the name), the P-61A entered service with the 18th Fighter Group in the South Pacifice and soon gained successes there and in Europe.  Buffet from the turret  led to this soon being deleted, but the B and C had pylons for the very heavy load of four 250 gal tanks or 6,400 (2900kg) bombs.  Total production was 941, followed by 35 slim photo-reconnaissance versions.

[Karnak]

Zanth,

The WWII P-61 topped out at 366mph.

425mph is BS for a WWII P-61 so don't base your hopes on that.

[Grits]

We use your "Hangar Queens" in the CT all the time. My point was, why add a plane that wont get used in either the MA or the CT? At least those early war planes will get used in the CT which is more than you can say for the P-61.

[DREDIOCK]

Originally posted by Grits
We use your "Hangar Queens" in the CT all the time. My point was, why add a plane that wont get used in either the MA or the CT? At least those early war planes will get used in the CT which is more than you can say for the P-61.

curious as to why you would think it wouldnt get used

[Drano]

Originally posted by DREDIOCK
curious as to why you would think it wouldnt get used

I think you could answer that yourself by telling us what it would get used for?

It was a purpose built night fighter that was rarely used othewise was it not? We never get much past dusk/dawn here and have all the radar info you'd want in any of the planes so where does the night fighter fit in?

Don't get me wrong I think its a neato lookin plane but I just don't see the point of it. Something more along the lines of a Ki-43 or a P-39 would get a lot more use I'd think. And not that they'd prolly be used a lot at that outside of events or the CT!


Drano

[CurtissP-6EHawk]

Originally posted by DREDIOCK
curious as to why you would think it wouldnt get used

Seldom ever get to fly the F4U...then when we do, its always ganged by the Georgettes!

[Stratocaster]

P-61 is damn fast I want it........ it cool looking too

[Shuckins]

The P-61 of WWII had a top speed of around 360 mph.  Nothing eye-popping there.

What it DID have was exceptional turning capability.  With full flaps it could outturn almost every American fighter...the only exceptions being the FM-2 and the P-63.  It's turning ability was almost identical to that of the F6F-5...in fact it was slightly better.

So there would be some use for it in the ma.

[Karnak]

Originally posted by Stratocaster
P-61 is damn fast I want it........ it cool looking too

366mph is damn fast?

That's news to me.

[Drano]

Originally posted by Shuckins
The P-61 of WWII had a top speed of around 360 mph.  Nothing eye-popping there.

What it DID have was exceptional turning capability.  With full flaps it could outturn almost every American fighter...the only exceptions being the FM-2 and the P-63.  It's turning ability was almost identical to that of the F6F-5...in fact it was slightly better.

So there would be some use for it in the ma.

So what do you do when engaging a plane with exceptional turning ability especially relative the plane you're flying? Turn with it? Of course not. Turn rate isn't everything.

If this thing only goes about 360 what I'm seeing is a bigger, slower P-38 that because of its massive weight and radial engines prolly sucks in the verticle bigtime and that would be exactly what I'd exploit when engaging it every time. The thing's neat lookin but hardly what I'd call "sleek". Hardly the definition of E retention.

Face it. This thing was designed to sneak up behind another plane flying in a straight line in the dark and blast it to smithereens with massive firepower. Think that's gonna happen a lot in the MA in broad daylight with full dar on? More than like maybe once? Heck I get about one AFK kill a month in the MA without the P-61!

Just trying to be the voice of reason. Same deal with the PBY. Why? Just a big pretty blue helpless target there.

    Drano

[brady]

What?? another American plane for AH!

............

 Seriously I hope to see all planes added eveunatinaly, I just would put several otthers before a P61 is all.

[Sp4de]

heh.. didnt think I would start this big argument...