Author Topic: HO dweebiness  (Read 368 times)

Offline RAM

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HO dweebiness
« Reply #15 on: March 11, 2000, 06:56:00 PM »
Now I am saving money for rudder pedals...then I need a new graphics card (average 20-25 fps), and then I'll buy a new stick...

man i really need money!!!  

And about how you fly P-38...well I dont say you do it wrong, P38 is IMO the best fighter over 28K in the arena right now. I say that the things could've been much better in a more aggresive style (much better for yah two...but also for me...SOME ACTION!!! LOL  )

And yes, while running after Toffer I thought "he is draggin" but I dismissed the thought saying "i'm going to catch him and kill him". It is evident that was a serious error of mine. I get killed many times because I get too greedy and I want to do more than I can. Is something I need to do hard work on...


SC-GManMP

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HO dweebiness
« Reply #16 on: March 11, 2000, 07:16:00 PM »
I'm about as new as they come and i also belong to one of the Top Squadrons to ever ace the cyberskies.  If i make an engagement, its not always in my best interest to fight in the position i'm in, but I usually go for it cuz its fun.  I was probably one of those aforementioned "dweeb" 38's yer talkin about.  I don't have a book on ACM, and haven't trained at all.  I have no appologies for the way I fly, cuz i'm here to have fun.  Its not at all fair to call anyone here a dweeb.  If someone uses something to thier advantage... so be it.. I have, will and do!  Like people calling the P-51 the "DweebStang" for instance.  Why call it that? cuz the plane can extend and get away from you in a blink? IMO a "dweeb" is someone who whines about things... I'm not saying you're whining Ram, but I don't think its fair that you criticize someone elses flying ability or style. We aren't all flying with flight plans and studying from the same book.  So have fun and enjoy the fights that come to you, no two fights are the same and thats what should be so exciting about online multiplayer flight sims, dweebs or no dweebs.

Offline Pappy

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HO dweebiness
« Reply #17 on: March 11, 2000, 11:34:00 PM »
HO.... well a third of fighter to fighter engagements in WWII at some point consisted of an "HO" and most of those ended in mid air collisions I assume with guns blazzing. I do agree in here nobody dies so most pilots press the "HO" issue more than they would in a real dogfight, you and yer wingman are flying a box patrol for targets of opportunity at 15k, suddenly you see 3 or 4 fighters only slightly higher flying out of the sun and already in the attack, you realize there is no suitable place to ditch, no cloud cover and no base for your squadies to pounce out of, do you HO, throw them some fancy text book moves or run like hell. In here most pilots are gona turn in to them to take-em out, your guns are as good as theirs, there are no lives at stake and runnin away don't move you up the kill board, so its realy tough to classify situations in a game with moves and logic from real combat, however maybe the game could be modified to allow for more realistic caution by first: spreading the bases out further (if ya can't jump off the ground fighting, flight time means more and engagements are more hard fought for position). Second: get rid of the overall map counters and radar(limit radar to circular regions around the bases with realisic gaps to exploit). Third: change the plane tags to "Bogey" at distances, "Bandit" if its hostile and then at closer ranges it changes to an identity tag "Spit", "B17" and so on. I race towards enemy aircraft I know I can most likely defeat when that red tag pops up at 7 or 8k out telling me what plane it is, ie a head on is brewing, here normaly in a WWII era plane you would try and get a visual confirmation and the position with the most advantage for youre plane, those old pictures of contrails from dogfights are largely from jockeying for position before they had to engage. Any or all these things could help trim some of the HO's down but its always gona be there.

Offline Minotaur

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HO dweebiness
« Reply #18 on: March 12, 2000, 09:11:00 AM »
1) HO's are part of the game

2) Get over it

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Offline milnko

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HO dweebiness
« Reply #19 on: March 12, 2000, 10:33:00 AM »
Arguably, the first few seconds of a fight are the most important.

With most dogfights lasting less than a minute, whoever grabs the advantage in the first few seconds usually wins. Ideally, you want to start the fight with an advantage, such as directly behind slightly low in his blind 6 o'clock position, usually that's not an option and you find yourself closing head-to-head with the bad guy.

At the merge you have a choice: enter a knife fight and rely on your turn performance to win the day (the angles fight), or use superior energy and hit-and-run tactics (the energy fight). Every fight is different, and an aircraft designed for angles fighting may find itself better suited for an energy fight. How do you decide which to use?
First, estimate your turn performance versus your opponent's. Being at and maintaining your corner speed means squat if the bandit can out-perform your best turn. Second, estimate your energy status. If you enter a fight 200 or 300 kts above your corner speed, don't merely waste all of that energy and decelerate to corner, initiate an energy fight and make use of that power. A well-flown energy fight is difficult to beat, as proven in Vietnam by F-4 pilots flying against MiG-17 and MiG-21 opponents.

Ask any combat pilot and he'll tell you the same thing: "If you get into a scissors fight, you screwed up."
A scissors is a series of reversing turns where each aircraft turn back towards each other, each trying to force the other out in front. A scissors usually begins when the attacker realizes he's going to overshoot.  The defender sees the imminent overshoot and reverses his turn back toward the attacker too early, thus resulting in a fairly
neutral pass. If you're an attacker, the only way you can get into a scissors duel is by screwing up and overshooting. If you're offensive, scissoring should be the last thing on your mind. If you're defensive,
you already screwed up. Reversing into a scissors indicates the attacker also made a mistake, but you compounded your error by
reversing too soon and wasting the advantage.
Once in a scissors, there's nothing to do but keep the G high and keep turning into the bandit. Of course, this bleeds speed and energy horrendously. Ideally, the "winner" of a scissors match forces thebandit ahead of him while still having enough energy to bring his nose to bear. More often, one aircraft stalls out and plummets earthward. If the other aircraft has any semblance of energy left it rolls, dives on the bandit, and shoots it before it recovers.
Alternatively, the participants may begin a series of barrel rolls instead of break turns.  This maintains some energy due to the
altitude/speed tradeoffs, but is far from an ideal solution. Each time the aircraft cross, they risk both collision and gunfire.  Passing too far apart allows your opponent a guns snapshot while passing too close
usually results in a crash. In short, scissoring is not good.
If you find yourself in a scissors, how do you get out?  In a guns only environment, executing a split-S immediately after crossing your opponent's tail usually does the trick. If you can rapidly increase and
maintain speed, you can extend beyond his gun range. Executing a split-S in a missile environment invites a heat seeker up your
exhaust. If you can't get outside the bandit's weapon range, then you have to win the scissors fight. If you can't win the fight by out-turning the bandit, you're dead.

 

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Offline -duma-

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HO dweebiness
« Reply #20 on: March 12, 2000, 11:22:00 AM »
Reminds me of a P38 pilot who came up on channel 1 after a fight this morning; 'Do you have any abilities beside the HO, duma?'
Well, since I now almost exclusively fly the 109G6, I'd hope so. It's a nice plane, but not much of a bite  

Sometimes the HO, especially after the merge, is the only way to end a fight successfully. It usually comes about when both planes are trying to be offensive at all times - it just doesn't work. In the case of this P38 pilot I could give the critiscism that he didn't extend far enough - he just went vertical and I caught him just as his nose passed towards me, before I could aim. The pilot could have survived had he not tried to go head on with me, but he pressed for the kill and, as I had a good 3 seconds to aim before he brought his nose to bear, I had the advantage. It would have been suicidal for me to break off the attack at that stage as I was at a high angle of attack and could simply not have evaded.

A good dogfight is a lot like a good boxing match - there's times to be offensive and times to evade. If it ends up in a head on then well, you should have evaded. If you couldn't evade then it's the other guys problem for pressing the attack with your nose pointed right at you  

I don't think a head on is as much of a dweeb move as a gamble. If you get a good angle on a head on which gives you the advantage and leaves the other guy struggling to aim (such as when you are diving, he is climbing and on the verge of a stall, and so has a less stable gun platform) I can't see how you can call that a dweeb move. Just learn to evade, it can often get you out of tricky situations  

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[This message has been edited by -duma- (edited 03-12-2000).]

Offline Duckwing6

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HO dweebiness
« Reply #21 on: March 12, 2000, 12:14:00 PM »
HO is only then a Dweeb move when you throw away all other options having advantage of alt/speed AND better turning aircraft -> that's a dweeb move ..