Author Topic: Question about MGFF/M lethality in AH (Read 430 times)

Wotan · « **on:** June 21, 2004, 01:19:23 PM »

I know this is a subject that usually resorts to an argument.

But I was reading a thread over at AGW and several replies from Hohun inspired me to start yet another mgff thread.

Here's the original thread on the "new agw"

http://agw.bombs-away.net/showthread.php?t=33605

Originally posted by Hohun

Quote

Hi everyone,

Here's a weapon comparison based on the sum of kinetic energy (at the muzzle) and chemical energy (equivalent to 120% of TNT). The ranking is based on firepower to weight ratio. The batteries are selected to offer similar firepower as the 8 x .50 Browning M2 battery. Weight includes ammunition for equal total destructivity (complete with drums/belts etc.).

I've also made a firepower comparison based on total projectile energy ca. 500 m downrange. Since figures for velocities are hard to find, I made the following assumptions:

12.7 mm projectile velocities have dropped to 650 m/s (about the Browning M2 value).

Hispano and MK103 velocities have dropped to 500 m/s (about the Hispano Mk II value).

All other cannon's velocities have dropped to 350 m/s (less than MG151/20 mine shell value).

1x MK 108 - 88 rpg - 111 kg - 220% firepower (96% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
1x MK 103 - 75 rpg - 210 kg - 178% firepower (86% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
2x Hispano V - 213 rpg - 189 kg - 108% firepower (72% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
2x Hispano II - 206 rpg - 201 kg - 93% firepower (70% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
2x MG 151/20 - 270 rpg - 199 kg - 85% firepower (71% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
4x MG-FF - 152 rpg - 318 kg - 101% firepower (80% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
8x ,50 Browning M2 - 250 rpg - 452 kg - 100% firepower (64% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)

As you can see, the Browning M2 loses destructiveness relatively quickly going downrange. That's simply because the lion's share of its energy is kinetic energy which is eaten up as the projectile travels downrange. The cannon have the lion's share of their destructive energy stored chemically, so it's preserved as the shell travels downrange.

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

Quote

Hi again,

Here's the table recalculated based on the 3:1:1 HE(M), HET, API belting for the MG FF/M and the MG151/20 mentioned by Tony in another thread. The Hispano II and V are based on the 2:2 HE, SAPI belting (as before).

1x MK 108 - 88 rpg - 111 kg - 220% firepower (96% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
1x MK 103 - 75 rpg - 210 kg - 178% firepower (86% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
2x MG 151/20 - 208 rpg - 173 kg - 111% firepower (78% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
2x Hispano V - 213 rpg - 189 kg - 108% firepower (72% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
2x Hispano II - 206 rpg - 201 kg - 93% firepower (70% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
3x MG-FF - 150 rpg - 236 kg - 102% firepower (84% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)
8x ,50 Browning M2 - 250 rpg - 452 kg - 100% firepower (64% of muzzle destructiveness at 500 m)

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

Understanding that these calculations; like Tony Williams', are not without flaws I have just 1 question:

Will there be a review of the mgff/m or are you guys satisfied with them as they currently are?

Admittedly this is flogging the same horse once again but I figured I would give it 1 more try.

TIA

Urchin · « **Reply #1 on:** June 21, 2004, 01:52:06 PM »

Seems like the MG-FF's are hitting harder in AH2. I was killing with snapshots when flying the 109E, something that happened only very rarely in AH1.

Wotan · « **Reply #2 on:** June 21, 2004, 02:14:16 PM »

I dont know, I was was inside d200 on an la5 and landed many hits, all cannon (I fire umm separately. He just nosed down and flew away.

Maybe I shoud try again...

Flyboy · « **Reply #3 on:** June 21, 2004, 03:36:38 PM »

well, either the chart is way wrong or AH is way wrong.

just look at the hispano results...

Flyboy · « **Reply #4 on:** June 21, 2004, 03:38:13 PM »

another thing, to me it seems that all the weapons got deadlier in AH2. a few pings with .50s will take out a wing.

Urchin · « **Reply #5 on:** June 21, 2004, 04:17:20 PM »

No, that chart meshes up pretty well with my AH experience, at least in AH1. I don't have enough experience in AH2 to say, but on average I'd say the Hizooka hits about 4x as hard as a .50, the MG-151 about 2.5-3X, and the MG-FF about 1.5 or so.

The La-7s guns and the Nikis gun rate above the MG-151 but below the Hizooka, don't know enough about the HO-5 to say but my impression was it hits about as hard as a Mg-151.

Wotan · « **Reply #6 on:** June 21, 2004, 05:36:13 PM »

I guess you maybe right Urchin I shot both wings of a 110 with 20 rounds cannon...

I fly it a few more times and see what happens...