The VOSS CONSPIRACY... fascinating new book

[WilldCrd]

Originally posted by eskimo2
Based on your name I gues we should consider you the expert on what is ghey.

Nice try Voss

eskimo

OMG the head shrinkers are gonna have to come up with a new name for this internet multible peronality shcizophrinic syndrome!

I would put forth the name of "The Mr. Black syndrome"

[eskimo2]

Originally posted by lazs2
I suppose it will be difficult to not think "potatonets" whenever the word "hornets" is brought up... they probly need a new avatar... put the one they have in a miniskirt and a lot of makeup maybe...

lazs

Oh man, that's good!

Arlo, you need to run with this idea.  Show us what you come up with.

eskimo

[SirLoin]

Originally posted by lazs2
I suppose it will be difficult to not think "potatonets" whenever the word "hornets" is brought up... they probly need a new avatar... put the one they have in a miniskirt and a lot of makeup maybe...

lazs

Hay Lazs...Why don't you post a pix of that Nazi SS dagger tattoo you had removed(or did you tattoo over it with something worse?)

[Westy]

Storch you're stump. Plain and simple.

 If I reposted all of it in ebonics or "hillbilly retard" would that be the "English" you're looking for?

[JAGED]

REQUEST FOR URGENT BUSINESS RELATIONSHIP

FIRST, I MUST SOLICIT YOUR STRICTEST CONFIDENCE IN THIS TRANSACTION. THIS IS BY VIRTUE OF ITS NATURE AS BEING UTTERLY CONFIDENTIAL AND 'TOP SECRET'. I AM SURE AND HAVE CONFIDENCE OF YOUR ABILITY AND RELIABILITY TO PROSECUTE A TRANSACTION OF THIS GREAT MAGNITUDE INVOLVING A PENDING TRANSACTION REQUIRING MAXIIMUM CONFIDENCE.

WE ARE TOP OFFICIAL OF THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT CONTRACT REVIEW PANEL WHO ARE INTERESTED IN IMPORATION OF GOODS INTO OUR COUNTRY WITH FUNDS WHICH ARE PRESENTLY TRAPPED IN NIGERIA. IN ORDER TO COMMENCE THIS BUSINESS WE SOLICIT YOUR ASSISTANCE TO ENABLE US TRANSFER INTO YOUR ACCOUNT THE SAID TRAPPED FUNDS.

THE SOURCE OF THIS FUND IS AS FOLLOWS; DURING THE LAST MILITARY REGIME HERE IN NIGERIA, THE GOVERNMENT OFFICIALS SET UP COMPANIES AND AWARDED THEMSELVES CONTRACTS WHICH WERE GROSSLY OVER-INVOICED IN VARIOUS MINISTRIES. THE PRESENT CIVILIAN GOVERNMENT SET UP A CONTRACT REVIEW PANEL AND WE HAVE IDENTIFIED A LOT OF INFLATED CONTRACT FUNDS WHICH ARE PRESENTLY FLOATING IN THE CENTRAL BANK OF NIGERIA READY FOR PAYMENT.

HOWEVER, BY VIRTUE OF OUR POSITION AS CIVIL SERVANTS AND MEMBERS OF THIS PANEL, WE CANNOT ACQUIRE THIS MONEY IN OUR NAMES. I HAVE THEREFORE, BEEN DELEGATED AS A MATTER OF TRUST BY MY COLLEAGUES OF THE PANEL TO LOOK FOR AN OVERSEAS PARTNER INTO WHOSE ACCOUNT WE WOULD TRANSFER THE SUM OF US$21,320,000.00(TWENTY ONE MILLION, THREE HUNDRED AND TWENTY THOUSAND U.S DOLLARS). HENCE WE ARE WRITING YOU THIS LETTER. WE HAVE AGREED TO SHARE THE MONEY THUS; 1. 20% FOR THE ACCOUNT OWNER 2. 70% FOR US (THE OFFICIALS) 3. 10% TO BE USED IN SETTLING TAXATION AND ALL LOCAL AND FOREIGN EXPENSES. IT IS FROM THE 70% THAT WE WISH TO COMMENCE THE IMPORTATION BUSINESS.

PLEASE,NOTE THAT THIS TRANSACTION IS 100% SAFE AND WE HOPE TO COMMENCE THE TRANSFER LATEST SEVEN (7) BANKING DAYS FROM THE DATE OF THE RECEIPT OF THE FOLLOWING INFORMATIOM BY TEL/FAX; 234-1-7740449, YOUR COMPANY'S SIGNED, AND STAMPED LETTERHEAD PAPER THE ABOVE INFORMATION WILL ENABLE US WRITE LETTERS OF CLAIM AND JOB DESCRIPTION RESPECTIVELY. THIS WAY WE WILL USE YOUR COMPANY'S NAME TO APPLY FOR PAYMENT AND RE-AWARD THE CONTRACT IN YOUR COMPANY'S NAME.

WE ARE LOOKING FORWARD TO DOING THIS BUSINESS WITH YOU AND SOLICIT YOUR CONFIDENTIALITY IN THIS TRANSATION. PLEASE ACKNOWLEDGE THE RECEIPT OF THIS LETTER USING THE ABOVE TEL/FAX NUMBERS. I WILL SEND YOU DETAILED INFORMATION OF THIS PENDING PROJECT WHEN I HAVE HEARD FROM YOU.

YOURS FAITHFULLY,

DR CLEMENT OKON

NOTE; PLEASE QUOTE THIS REFERENCE NUMBER (VE/S/09/99) IN ALL YOUR RESPONSES.

[ghostdancer]

Originally posted by eskimo2
Seriously ghostdancer,

Overlag’s thinking is how criminal minds justify their behavior.  Don’t try to understand it; it won’t make sense to you.

eskimo

Oh, I misunderstood then .. I thought Overlag was speaking for himself saying that he (Overlag) thought it was okay because they were stupid and thus deserved to be scammed.

If he was actually talking about how Voss justified doing what he did in his own mind (Voss's Mind), I take back any sarcasm or scorn in my writing toward Overlag.

I actually agree that Voss probably thought what he was doing was justified (twisted it around and is still doing so) in his mind so that he is blameless and that the other people are the one's who deserved it or actually are the one's who caused it.

Very typical thing in human nature is that nobody percieves themselves to be a bad person or to be doing immoral actions. And that they find a point of view or perspective that justifies their actions to themselves.

[Red Tail 444]

This is actually a lot more than just taking some money from some unknowing victim. Crimes of Persuasion are probably the most sinister of all scams, because the investors arent just off the street types, most of them are friends and close associates, believing they are helping someone they know well, to get their business rolling.

This is actually a good leson next time someone wants you to invest in their busines.

Internet fraud  / investment fraud is a real crime, and if anyone who has been burned in this particular scheme has a legitmate course of legal /law enforcement action to take if they want to get their money back.

http://www.sec.gov/investor/pubs/cyberfraud.htm

In any event, perhaps reporting this so there's an official record of it may prevent him from taking advantage of other people in the future.

[storch]

Originally posted by ghostdancer
First off Voss was not a person who just came into the community and 2 days later started asking for money. He spent considerable time participating in the flight sim community and building up relationships in it and credibility. He then went on to create false credentials (F16 pilot, ownership of P51, etc.) of his capability and experience to further  bolster credibility in the eyes that he had interacted with online. Then over an extended period of time to continue to foster the illusion of work being done by putting out screen shots of a project that he was supposedly having programmed when no such programming being done.

The fault of the people here is that they did not ask more detailed questions earlier than when Robey did. They had known him online for some time playing online, wanted to believe that a better sim could be built, and Voss used these online relationships he built (the trust and camaraderie he had built up flying and participating online) couple with false credentials (exposed later) to take advantage of people.

So yes, they did not know him personally face to face but they did know him. The problem is, even in real life, you can’t know anybody 100% exactly. Plenty of people know the person that scam them and have met them face to face and have even done research on the proposed project, company, etc. (ever here of Enron, Adelphia, WorldComm, etc.)

But I can’t understand your logic that they deserved to get ripped off and that Voss is free of culpability.

By your logic if  I go to London, take the tube, have my wallet in my back hip pocket and then get pick pocketed I was stupid so I deserve it and the pick pocket is blameless and its fine to take advantage of somebody else if they are being, in your view stupid.

Or I forget to lock my house when I go to work and I come home and have been robbed. Well I was stupid and deserved to be robbed because I forgot to lock up .. so the thieves are somehow blameless in the matter.

In the U.S. that is not how it is supposed to work .. our laws and belief in justice is not built on the principal of caveat emptor (buyer beware). Yes, the buyer still has to be beware but we don’t wash our hands of it if they are taken, saying too bad you should have known better or its your own fault so you deserved it.

Which is why Enron and Adelphia and Worldcomm are being prosecuted. Otherwise by your logic .. hey, employees who sunk tons of money into 401Ks and stocks in the company and then lossed it all .. its your fault because you did not do due enoug diligence and discovered that management was running a scam. It doesn’t matter that they presented false credentials, lied, doctored documents, and misled to give a false impression of credibility and trust worthiness so that you would invest in them. You were stupid in investing in people you did not personally know and so deserve to be ripped off.

Nice logic there.

And as for the examples yes a difference of scale in the case of Enron. The sad thing about the American justice system is that money matters. When you are on Enron scale the prosecutors, lawyers and government will go all out. But at small claims court  unfortunately many times it’s the case that to fully pursue your case you end up spending more money to get legal satisfaction and remedy than you initially lossed.

From what I understand Michael Hobuss resolved the matter when he got the equipment back eventually from Voss that he bought . So basically he was conned into purchasing a server and equipment for a bogus project. He got the equipment back but like a car he paid full value for the equipment and put a strain on his finances to fund and support a bogus project. Even with the equipment back he basically had to eat the outlay of funds for even if he sold the equipment he could not sale it for what he bought it for. Could Michael Hobuss pursue the matter and had Voss possibly jailed for fraud. Yes, but it seems he considered how much more it would cost to do so and the time involved and decided it wasn’t worth the additional lost time and money to do so and basically said give me my equipment back and that is it. It’s a common thing that happens in our legal system that people let petty crooks go after recovering something instead of spending 2 to 3 times as much trying to prosecute them. In my opinion it’s a failing in the American legal system.

But hey, Michael Hobuss deserve it. The people Voss was trying to scam and making sign NDA's deserved it. The people who sent in donations to a fictitious restoration project of a world war II plane deserved it. They didn't need that petty change anyways. If they did I am sure they would go cross country to the appropriate state small claims court and spend whatever money and time necessary to and pursue the matter to gain back their $10, $20, or whatever amount.

They all deserved to be ripped off because they were stupid and lazy and it doesn't really matter since Voss didn't really make anything substantial off of it.

In no way is this paul hinds person to be thought of as blameless.  irrespective of what he did with the investment money.  Forgive me, I haven't read the entire thread nor will I.  If he was contracted (was there a written contract?) to perform and provide specific services for a specific sum of money the victims have a case.  If it was verbally agreed to it would depend on the State (States?) in which this brouhaha occurred.  In Florida vebal contracts are enforcable.

Now to the practical matter.  This is really a cautionary tale.  It seems most of you are very naive and have very little experience in the rough and tumble world of business.  This goes on all the time.  It has happened to me.  Sadly it gets to the point that if my mom tells me it's daytime I look to verify.  Pretty simply concept, as one of my old time Heros said "trust but verify"  And even then at times you can be swindled.  There are sophisticated swindlers out there watch out.

There would be no point in prosecuting to attempt to recover the loss.  It's been my experience that bottom dwellers like paul hinds have no assests.  You may engage an attorney and you will likely win a judgement against him but it will only be a moral victory for you and a note payment or two for the real criminals in our society  the attorneys involved.

[Jackal1]

Originally posted by Overlag
that is it





and anyway, if anyone is stupid enough to send money, over the internet to someone they dont know, they DESERVE TO GET RIPPED OFF OK?


hey guys, im starting a new game, please all send me $100 so i can start developing it for you

Just curious. You ever bought anything over the internet?

[Trell]

Originally posted by Jackal1
Just curious. You ever bought anything over the internet?

Do you buy from any web site that you happen to find?  or do you look into there past customer history?  do you do any type of reserch into the company?

[Red Tail 444]

Originally posted by storch
There would be no point in prosecuting to attempt to recover the loss.  It's been my experience that bottom dwellers like paul hinds have no assests.  You may engage an attorney and you will likely win a judgement against him but it will only be a moral victory for you and a note payment or two for the real criminals in our society  the attorneys involved.

So next time some crackhead breaks into your home and turns your jewely into his smoke-up, no need in prosecuting him because he's broke anyway....

As for moral victory seekers,  AH is entirely about moral victories  Why do you think we're paying 15 a month?

[Airhead]

Originally posted by GtoRA2
LOL the thing about any of airheads post recently, is you just can not take them seriously.

He used to be funny, and now I can not tell if he is trying to be funny or if he is really pissed off.

 Not pissed and not trying to be funny, GTO. Trying to be serious for a bit (life has been serious lately instead of fun, it's a cyclical thingie) and seriously- almost 600 posts condemning the 418th cause Voss is a member?

If he ripped you off, sue him. If you have knowledge he's conspiring to commit a crime, call the police. And if your respect for somebody has diminished because they're members of the 418th then get therapy, you need it.

Now have a nice day. Seriously.

[Masherbrum]

This thread is fast running out of steam.

Karaya

[WilldCrd]

Originally posted by Masherbrum
This thread is fast running out of steam.

Karaya

bah its early the main charaters will show up again soon....patience sir patience

[Yeager]

so what started all this anyway?  voss killed fester?