Author Topic: The US track and field team... (Read 990 times)

Red Tail 444 · « **Reply #30 on:** July 16, 2004, 12:06:34 AM »

"Now, I have to be careful what I'm saying, but it seems funny to me that it's only athletes in the power events who ever seem to have colds," said Cram.

Butch Reynolds was banned for life for taking prescription medication back in 1987, I believe...he was a 400 meter runner. Sudafed and some other OTC drugs contain trace elements of substances that are believed to enhance performance. even caffeine is a banned substance, as is tobacco, as is alcohol.

better not take NyQuil, either. 10% alcohol...

Where is the quote from Carl Lewis that he took anything that was banned or otherwise? Also, would Reuters claim someone as a hyprocrite? Isin't that placing judgement?

Nash · « **Reply #31 on:** July 16, 2004, 12:22:24 AM »

Okay.... I hear ya? Uh huh... I am readin' yer email. Yeah, Uh- huh? Yup, here it is...

Dope.

DOPE.

Screw alla cold remedy whatever...

If yer in the Olympics pre 2004 you are having a tender suckle at the fruity nipple of JUICE.

Still don't know why that's considered so outrageous.

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #32 on:** July 16, 2004, 02:09:29 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Red Tail 444
Where is the quote from Carl Lewis that he took anything that was banned or otherwise? Also, would Reuters claim someone as a hyprocrite? Isin't that placing judgement?

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/04/17/1050172709693.html?oneclick=true

Quote

"Lewis and two of his training partners all took the same three types of banned stimulants and were caught at the 1988 US Olympic trials, according to the documents released by a disgruntled former senior US anti-doping official, Dr Wade Exum.

But on appeal to their national Olympic committee, all were cleared of inadvertent doping. Two months later, at the Seoul Olympics, Lewis finished second in the 100 metres sprint. But when Canadian Ben Johnson failed his Olympic drug test, Lewis was awarded the 100m gold."

"The latest documents show Lewis tested positive for the banned stimulants found in cold medications: pseudoephedrine, ephedrine and phenylpropanolamine."

Ben Johnson tested positive for Winstrol, a common anabolic steroid, which is taken in a regimented fashion. It is nearly impossible to take it inadvertently. Psuedophedrine and ephedrine have effects similar to epinephrine (adrenaline) and can be found in products like Ibuprofen cold and sinus, Sinutab, Aleve, Sudafed, etc.

Many athletes go to world championships or the Olympic Games and are attacked by whatever viruses are common to the new environs which were not common at training sites. Andy Sudduth was the single scull rower for the USA was considered a strong contender for a medal but fought a cold during his time in Korea. He made the finals but came in sixth after years of training and dreaming to achieve his goal.

The reason the US Track team is under such scrutiny is because the United States Anti Doping Agency is taking a much tougher stance than the previous oversight organization. Marion Jones never failed a test but the USADA considered sanctions against her for their strong suspicion. There is no reasonable doubt threshold.

Nashwan · « **Reply #33 on:** July 16, 2004, 06:49:32 AM »

400m is a power event.

As to sudafed:

Carl Lewis failed a drugs test. He claims it's because he took medicine that contained ephedrine. He's hardly likely to have thrown his hands up and admitted to taking drugs, is he?

Sudafed is the excuse. How long do you think the tiny amounts of ephedrine in cold medicine stay in the body? Ever seen carl Lewis look like he had a cold before one of his races? Ever see any sprinter look like he had a cold? Ever think that if he really had a cold, he'd have zero chance of even reaching the final?

Sudafed is the excuse, like failing a breath test and claiming it was the medicine you took. Of course you weren't drink driving. Thing is, the courts won't listen, but the athletics associations were all too ready to listen.

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #34 on:** July 16, 2004, 07:24:18 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Nashwan
Ever think that if he really had a cold, he'd have zero chance of even reaching the final?

Andy Sudduth reached the final in rowing in '88 with a cold.

myelo · « **Reply #35 on:** July 16, 2004, 08:59:29 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by vorticon
shame we dont have uber-fast smallish drug test machines...then we could just test em before the race even starts...

That only works for drugs that enhance performance while in the body, like stimulants.

The problem with anabolic steroids is they are used in the training phase to incresae muscle mass and strength. They stop the drugs long enough before the test so that it's out of their system. Of course every now and then they get the timing wrong and get busted.

The only way to effectively ban steroids is with random unannounced tests throughout the year.

FUNKED1 · « **Reply #36 on:** July 16, 2004, 06:25:21 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by FUNKED1
This is starting to remind me of the Avro Arrow thread.

Nash · « **Reply #37 on:** July 16, 2004, 06:38:30 PM »

Yeah Funked...

An Olympic athlete taking drugs... What a stretch...

some people, eh?

Torque · « **Reply #38 on:** July 16, 2004, 06:41:22 PM »

The IOC has been for year auctioning off the medals and games to the highest bidder.

You want a level playing field checkout the Special Olympics.

midnight Target · « **Reply #39 on:** July 16, 2004, 07:02:02 PM »

I was teaching in 1984. One of my co-workers (Fred) was a world class sprinter (10.0 100 meter), and his wife was a 22+ foot long jumper. She placed 8th in the US Olympic trials. He ran for the US Team in the Pan Am Games and some other thing down in Australia.

Both were convinced that Lewis was juiced. Fred's main reason was the lack of peaks and valleys Lewis exhibited over the years.
They also thought Carol Lewis (sister and long jumper) was the ***** from hell.

But the person they hated the most of all was Daley Thomson. He was according to them the most arrogant unfriendly and self centered salamander in the entire T & F community.

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #40 on:** July 16, 2004, 09:15:17 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Nash
An Olympic athlete taking drugs... What a stretch...

some people, eh?

What I was pointing out Nash, it that there is a diference in admitting that there is a problem with performance enhancing drug use in athletics, and accusing every single athlete of being doped because they compete on a high level.

Argentine Football (Soccer) legend Mardona was diciplined for drug use, professional cycling, Baseball, Basketball, American football, all have had these issues so drug abuse is certianly not limited to only Olympic athletes. It obviously is a huge issue, but to say they are all on dope is falsely accusing innocents among the guilty.

If, for instance, one were to accuse all of a certian race of sharing a certian behavior, that would be wrong wouldn't it? Same thing here.

Nash · « **Reply #41 on:** July 16, 2004, 09:25:48 PM »

True enough Holden.

My response was actually in response to Funked who posted a link to tinfoil hats, then thought that was so neat that he ended up quoting himself and posting it again.

Yeah, blanket statements (such as mine) saying that all athletes using drugs are just wrong. OTOH, some mocking defense of an individual's circumstance which you know next to nothing about is just as off.

Yeah, not everone uses/used drugs. Many do/did. I haven't personally handled Lewis' test result (would be kind of hard since it got shredded) but I know enough about Lewis, doping and the entire context of the whole thing to come to a pretty strong conclusion about it. I highly, highly doubt it, but I could be wrong.

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #42 on:** July 16, 2004, 09:38:26 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Nash
OTOH, some mocking defense of an individual's circumstance which you know next to nothing about is just as off.

I haven't personally handled Lewis' test result...

So were you off when you made comments about "an individual's circumstance which you know next to nothing about"?

I competed in single sculls in the '88 trials and went to several camps over the years to compete for a seat on the sweep crew. I have many friends who have been on US National Rowing teams. I have yet to meet a rower who I have suspected of intentionally using performance enhancing drugs and I have yet to speak with another rower who has had the suspicion.

Nash · « **Reply #43 on:** July 16, 2004, 09:48:21 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Holden McGroin
So were you off when you made comments about "an individual's circumstance which you know next to nothing about"?

I'm not seeing the connection... but no. I know something about it. Like I said, I could be wrong. But my opinion, while just that, is informed... And I'm not wearing no hat.

And my informed guess is that as the testing gets as refined as the masking, you are not going to see near some of the times/distances posted as what we'll probably look back and refer to as the wonder years.

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #44 on:** July 16, 2004, 10:11:34 PM »

The connection is quite obvious. You have not seen the test results and yet you seem to think you are fully informed about Carl Lewis.

I am glad you won't be sitting on any jury in judgement of me.

I have some personal experience in international athletic competition, (I will be up your way in Edmonton next summer for the World Masters Games as I still compete... at an even faster speed, although we race half the Olympic distance.)

Records are made to be broken, and when Roger Bannister broke the unbreakable four minute mile barrier, I doubt he was helped with questionable substances yet he was able to better everyone who ran before him.

Dispite the recently published tabloid journalism book, I believe that Lance Armstrong pushes through personal pain thresholds because he knows he's had worse. Whatever happens on the bike is much less than what he experienced in the hospital. This gives him a depth of character that leads him to be able to train harder than his rivals. As he has never failed a drug test, I believe he is clean.

Cheaters will always be with us, but there are those who better their performance through depth of character, better technique and hard work. I know many of them, and I would like to think I am among them.