IRS and Jerry Falwell

[Octavius]

"Falwell is thumbing his nose at the IRS," Lynn said. "He must not be permitted to use a tax-exempt ministry to engage in partisan politics. The vast majority of America's religious institutions play by the rules. He should too."[/size]

[edit]:  Heh, forgot the link.  here

[Gunslinger]

not that I care about Jerry Fallwell but do you know the orriginal source of this quote or do you make it a general practice of quoting yourself?

[Octavius]

how embarrassing, I forgot the link.  Hang on

[demaw1]

Since when did ministers become 2nd class citizens and cant have opinions and the freedom to voice them any where they please.Tax exempt or not, big deal.Just where in the hell do you think the talk of our freedom and over taxation started..OH no God forbid it started in the churches and the churches played a large part in the war for freedom.If u are black where u think the talk against slavery started...joes bar and grill? No the churches in the north.How many of you have said anything about the most reverand jessie jackson and his combining polictics and preaching emmm.I havent heard anything on it.Hell he even shakes down corp.and doesnt pay taxes on it.What ,you dont think ,a preacher or someone in a church never picked up a rifle to defend your freedom?It may be chick in norway and canada and other places to throw preachers in jail for preaching how they always have,but believe me when you try it here the outcome will be very different.
 What ever happen to the liberals favorite line...if you dont like it just turn the knob...Well just turn the knob...I dont like a lot of things preachers say , and i hate what people like m.moore say but we must have freedom for both, or 1 day someone will come to take a freedom from you that you like and who will be left to fight for it then?

[crowMAW]

Originally posted by demaw1
Since when did ministers become 2nd class citizens and cant have opinions and the freedom to voice them any where they please.

No one is trying to take away his freedom of speach.  He can continue to say whatever he wants.  However, if he is going to campaign for a candidate with church funds[/i], then the church becomes a PAC...which is fine...no problem there at all...but they have to give up the tax exempt status afforded to churches.

There is a very clear and bright line between church and PAC.  And every preacher in the land should know it by now.  In a church sermon or function[/i] you can talk about God and religion all you want...you can talk about the importance of voting...you can talk about the importance of voting for a candidate that represents your views...you can talk about the attributes that a candidate should have...but, the moment you say the candidate's name, or say vote Democrat, or vote for the incumbant or vote for the challenger, then you have just created a political action committee and PACs are not tax exempt.  The preacher can still say what ever he wants though.

[Curval]

Thumbing one's nose at the most omnipotent organisation in the world is not smart.

[Holden McGroin]

So what happens to your tax status if you invite the candidate to speak to your congregation?  Is not that a de facto endorsement?

[crowMAW]

Originally posted by Holden McGroin
So what happens to your tax status if you invite the candidate to speak to your congregation?  Is not that a de facto endorsement?

That one is a little more muddy.  Depending on the circumstances it may not be legally considered a endorsement under the IRS rules.

Churches can invite candidates to speak so long as they afford equal opportunity to the other opposing candidates.  Fundraising for the candidate while at the church function is not allowed.  Also, church officials cannot make statements that indicate a bias during the function.

They can also invite individuals running for office to speak in an "non-candidate" role.  The non-candidate role means that no mention should be made that the speaker is running for an office and no campaigning can be done.  Churches do not have to afford equal time in this situation.

[storch]

This law to which you refer was actually an executive order by LBJ in a successful attempt to curb critizism for his "Great Society" legislation prior to it being signed into law.

Preachers in the south were railing against LBJ and his policies and that was how he silenced them.  He denied all people of faith hence their right to hear the political opinions of the leaders from the pulpit.

This (law?) needs to be challenged in the courts.

Imagine if the same criteria were applied to the NAACP also a not for profit and in the same category as churches.

Many homosexual not for profits also actively participate in political debate with no challenges to their tax exempt status.

I hope they do cite Reverend Falwell and I hope that this will be fought in the courts.  I believe that with the current crop of legal counsel providing pro bono service to the faith community we may at last be able to have our political views shared openly from our pulpits and the battle to win back the culture from the leftist extremists can earnestly begin.

Great post, thanks for sharing it.

[storch]

Originally posted by Holden McGroin
So what happens to your tax status if you invite the candidate to speak to your congregation?  Is not that a de facto endorsement?

I don't believe candidates may address a congregation if they are discussing their political views or seeking contributions.

[Ripsnort]

Originally posted by storch
I don't believe candidates may address a congregation if they are discussing their political views or seeking contributions.

^^:aok

[Udie]

Originally posted by storch
I don't believe candidates may address a congregation if they are discussing their political views or seeking contributions.

don't think that's ever stopped many of them, from both parties.

[demaw1]

re. What churches can and cant say.

 There have been times in our country when people have tried to suppress almost everything,newspaper buildings burnt down,and yes owners of newspapers and reporters killed.The very same thing has happened with churches.There will always be thugs in any country.The so called seperation of church and state is pure myth started in the early 1960s by an supreme court that threw out every previous supreme court ruling concerning this topic because they were an enlighten court.Storch was right about lbj,although I dont think it is time for court battle yet.Crowmaws writing was very well done much better than I can do, but the arguements were,I believe in accord with the freedom from religion crowd.Until till the 60s ministers aways have been a force in politics.I say crowmaw what do you think would happen I f you tried to throw lincoln in jail,he campained in many churches, ok than so did FDR,and so did many others.The left is very much involved in not only trying to silence preachers but christians as well.There are 2 main stream ministers [that I can think of now] that are either in court or soon will be because of their sermons on homosexuality.Because of the inherit evil in mans heart once you start down this road it will never stop.It will only take1 generation to destory A merica and the Judeo/christian heritage that gave us our freedom.We are now at the crossroads.

[xrtoronto]

Falwell? lol...he's the knucklehead that wanted the childrens show Teletubbies banned because he thought one of the characters was gay? I was laughing so hard I can't remember which one!

[AKIron]

Falwell thumbed his nose at the IRS??? Damn, I'm beginning to like this guy.