Fighter Rear View Mirrors

[Halo]

Is it feasible to model fighter plane rear view mirrors in AH, e.g. in Spits?  How effective were they in real planes like the Spit and Hurri and a few other British planes?  Any other nations' fighters use rear view mirrors?

I recall fighter rear view mirror modeled in old Battle of Britain game for Atari way back when.  Just checked WWII plane book and sure enough, all the Spit pics had the rear view mirror.  

[BUG_EAF322]

that might only be for the spit-IA
not sure about that
 

[bloom25]

Rear view mirrors are one of those nice touches, but I guess it would really impact framerate.

(IRL they were pretty worthless, too many vibrations from what I've read.)



------------------
bloom25
THUNDERBIRDS

[Citabria]

the current 6 view is already overly generous in its ability to check both left and right rear view at the same time.

the quarter views of the AH view system if tilted back another 10-15 degrees would be much more realistic in the way a pilot cleared their aircraft as it would still provide a direct 6 view but not the roadkill linda blair owl head 6 view.

this was impossible in combat in real fighters especially fighters like the f4u, spitfire, 109 and many others with wide rear fuselage bulkheads.

it was possible to look down one rear side of the aircraft or the other but not both at the same time.

it is physically impossible and totally unrealistic and it is one thing about AH that really annoys me because it is part of the reason why SA is so rediculously high in AH


mirrors were pretty ineffective do to massive vibrations as well in actual ww2 aircraft

the saying goes: "if you can see them in your mirror then its already to late. time to bail out"


but HTC will never fix it. they dont give a crap about realistic rear view situational awareness.

[SKurj]

I read an autobiography of a Candian Spit pilot in ww2.  He ripped out the mirror in his spit V due to it being of little help.

AKSKurj

[Westy]

 HiTech already answered this about two to three weeks ago in here. Essentially there would be a very large FPS hit and there are other larger fish to fry at this time.

Do a ubb search on "mirror". You'll find the topic.

-Westy

[-lazs-]

On the vibration thing... They did not vibrate, at least, not on the manly blue radial equipped planes.   I have talked with people that still fly em.  The R2800 was probably the smoothest engine in the war.   I have never heard that vibration was a problem for any mirror except for the early 109.   Also, the 190 lengthened it's motor mounts somewhere around the A5 to get rid of some vibration.   Ask any pilot at an air show and they will tell you that the mirrors work just fine.   A relative that flew Hellcats said that the mirror was quit usefull and worked about the same as one on a car.   Not sure about the Spits... Reports differ.

If the view system is too generous it is too generous for all planes right?   If that is the case then the ones that had mirrors are still being disadvantaged and should either have mirrors or an even better rear view than those who didn't.

Having said that.... After coming from the other sim I don't really feel too crapped on here by the AH views.
lazs

[This message has been edited by -lazs- (edited 11-29-2000).]

[Halo]

Thanks for the info.  Sorry I didn't do a search first, but didn't realize how good the search here is: outstanding.  

I like the AH view system but just wondered about the rear view mirrors. The search added some more interesting info but I appreciate the responses here too.    

[Duckwing6]

I can tell you i've spent countless hours staring into mirrors attached to airplanes trying to see a bogey on my short 6...

what i'm talking about is glider towing  

But i can tell you .. if it's not for engine vibrations, air buffeting, turbulenze, etc will do the trick , i mean the field of view is VERY narrow and seeing a glider attached to your tail with a 30 yard rope can be dificult enough sometimes, i don't even dare to beliefe they were of any use to see a bogey on your long 6 saddling up for the kill ..

IMHO they were more used for formation flying and ground operations (yes it might be important what's behind you on the ground) than actually in combat (even tho i think it WAS possible to see guys like Hartmann in your mirror (usual kill distance under 50 yards) but i guess if you saw him you were dead anyaways  

and here's a pic to comprehend.. th "target" is a LO100 aerobatic glider wingspan roughly 30 feet)
 

DW6

[Westy]

DW6  666666666666666666666!"

Break right and I'll come up behind em  

[Ripsnort]

Cool Duck, just for grins, ya ought to have the glider carry a paint ball gun, and see if  he can hit you in critical areas of your fuselage!  

[Bolletje]

Hey Bug!
I'd like to make an appointment with you....Could you call me?! My number is registed in your cell-phone....
Thanx

 

Originally posted by BUG_EAF322:
that might only be for the spit-IA
not sure about that
 

[Rickenbacker]

I agree with Duckwing here. Though I've only tried that as the guy on the other end of the string, I know that you don't have to veer off very far before they tow driver loses sight of you.

We had a Socata Rallye towing for us for a while, which had a mirror on top of the canopy frame much like the ones shown in pics of spits and corsairs. With this mirror the tow pilot couldn't see me holding the wing of the glider, i.e. about 8m out from center, maybe 50m behind him, so we had to put another guy in front of the tow plane to repeat the wingholders' signals.

My conclusion is that if you can't see more than that in a mirror, why bother? You'll be dead by the time a con sneaks in that close anyway.

 

[BUG_EAF322]

Damn girls now she find's me on the message board  

That is off topic Bolletje

[Replicant]

I saw an interview with a Spitfire pilot and he was talking about the rear view mirror.  Initially most Spitfire's were not equiped with mirrors so the pilots would take the rear view mirror out of a car, such as an Austin 7 and place it above the canopy.  Eventually proper mirrors were installed which had a better fixing and better definition of rear view.

I can understand the big fps hit... shame really because I would love this facility being available at sometime (snap/instant views affect a condition I have so I have to use pan... which can be slow at times!!!).

Regards

'Nexx'