Author Topic: very bad month for Warbirds....  (Read 411 times)

Offline hazed-

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« on: June 09, 2001, 02:06:00 PM »
there has been 3 fatal crashes in the last month at various airshows around the world.

a vampire crashed killing its pilot at the biggin hill airshow, a spitfire crashed at the french memorial airshow killing the pilot.There was another but i cant remeber the aircraft, but dont you think its weird they all happened so close together? and all 3 were fatal.

sad time for those of us that love these old planes.My condolenses to the families of those killed and to those who have put their heart and soul into restoring these great planes and flying them for our pleasure.

Offline Duckwing6

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #1 on: June 09, 2001, 02:34:00 PM »
The other was supposedly a P-63 (?) Bell King Cobra .. also at the Biggin Hill Airshow .. just the day after the Vampire crashed there as well ..

yea tragic weekend this one.
Fortunately nobody of the crowd was injured !

DW6

Offline hazed-

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #2 on: June 09, 2001, 02:37:00 PM »
thanx duck youre right it was a cobra.

Offline Spatula

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2001, 07:42:00 PM »
<S> those that make the effort to fly, maintain, restore vintage aircraft. Without them, these aircraft would only exist in text books and photographs.

A double tragedy when one crashes. A sixfold tragedy when 3 go down taking their pilots with them.

My condolences to their families.
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Offline Hajo

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2001, 09:00:00 PM »
Everytime I read a newspaper, or read a post that states that a warbird crashed, and took the life of it's pilot makes me very sad indeed.  I fortunately have the opportunity to take my son to wright patterson afb museum in Dayton, Ohio.  I explained to him what the young men did in these machines during world war 2.  I explained that some were as young as 17 years of age, many had never been away from home, and were thrust into the position of having death tug on his shirt sleeves everyday.  What a way to grow up.

I also sometimes think that people are placed in history, in an exact time and place to accomplish something.

Most or all of the young men who fought in WW2 suffered through "the great depression " of the late 1920s' basically up until the war started.  Were they there, placed by History to be toughened up?  To experience the hardships that many people suffered through that terrible Depression? Who knows?

Everytime a warbird goes down, a piece of our History dies with it.  It's Museums such as Wright Patterson, and the Smithsonian air and space Museum, as well as others that preserve our history, and remind us of the mistakes mankind has made.

Let's not forget the valiant young men, who actually flew those craft during the war.  Let's not forget the lessons that war teaches us.  and lets not forget to teach our children about what our fathers, and grandfathers did to preserve freedom, at all costs, so that we can continue to live the life we lead today.

<S> vets, nicely done

Hajo

[ 06-09-2001: Message edited by: Hajo ]
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Offline Yeager

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2001, 12:16:00 AM »
This only intensifies the argument for grounding these classic airframes once and for all.  At this rate of attrition how long do these old frames have left.

Sad truth is there are far more humans left than old WB airframes...

Think on it.

Y
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Offline StSanta

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2001, 02:00:00 AM »
I'm of the line of thought that planes should *fly*. Put one of each in a dusty museum somewhere, but let the rest *fly*.

To me it seems like taking a tiger and locking it up. Warbirds look just like hunters ready to go, and IMHO, they should be flown, not caged.

Offline llbm_MOL

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #7 on: June 10, 2001, 02:04:00 AM »
Yeager shut up...........

You fly is open!

Made ya look..........

Anyway.......If I fixed up a damn vintage WWII aircraft I'm damn sure gonna fly it! No one is gonna stop me either If I do all the investing. You seem to think this is public domain. Its not. Damn sure hope we aint livin in the USSR(old one that is) yet. I know were getting close but I hope it waits till I die...........


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Offline DB603

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #8 on: June 10, 2001, 04:49:00 AM »
S!

 Sad to see one of them down again with human losses  :( Any clue what caused the crash of the P63?Technical failure or pilot error?
 In Finland there's one VERY rare warbird still flying.The Gloster Gauntlet Mk.II.Last known airworthy in the world.
 I agree that those warbirds should fly but with extreme caution.They aren't lame Cessnas with easy characteristics,but hunters with their own quirks.No combat style gung-ho or "leme show how this bird rocks"-style.

Offline Duckwing6

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #9 on: June 10, 2001, 06:37:00 AM »
Aparantly he entered a vertical manouver and never recovered on the down line .. but i doubt that the cause is yet know ...

I'm all for it rear birds HAVE to fly .. you can't appreciate them when you just see them in a museum and you've never heared them nor seen them fly.

DW6

Offline Hajo

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #10 on: June 10, 2001, 09:36:00 PM »
Fact is the pilots flying these warbirds have little training in them.  Guys like anderson, Yeager etc. though they are old, know them well

we can make replicas, but through attrition at some point in time they will all crash....fact of life, airframe hours, pilots with little training in them etc.

Put them in museums, we know what an aircraft looks like in flight.  I can see them whenever I want to on tape etc. in flight.  I have guncam film of both LW and allies........protect them before they disappear altogether.
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Offline Toad

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #11 on: June 10, 2001, 10:01:00 PM »
When not flown aggressively, most of these aircraft are reasonably docile. Cruising around the pattern, going cross country, flying at weights far below combat weights really should beno big deal.

In an airshow environment some guys do things that _accidentally_ push into the agressive part of the envelope. I don't know of anyone in Warbirds that INTENTIONALLY pushes the envelope at an airshow. Most of the loops and rolls are pretty tame. Sometimes accidents happen though, with tragic results.

I will speculate on this much: If they ban the flying of warbirds, you can figure restorations will essentially stop. What's flying now will be sold into display situations and they'll sell for a heck of a lot less than they do as "flyable aircraft".

There will be no financial incentive to find and restore old warbirds.

Look, they are history. They need to be preserved. However, the guys with the money and desire to do that want to see them fly and/or fly them themselves.

Before the CAF started really raising the consciousness about saving these airplanes, they were rapidly being scrapped out of existence.

Sh*t happens. You're going to lose some.

But if you have the drawings, desire and money, they can be reborn. Look at the FW-190 coming out of Germany and the Me-262's in Seattle.

People restore them to FLY them. Go figure.   ;)
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Offline streakeagle

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #12 on: June 10, 2001, 11:50:00 PM »
I have a 1980 corvette with the optional L-82 hi-performance engine. When I bought it in 1995 it had 28000 miles, now over 140000 miles. I enjoyed everyone of them. I hardened up the suspension and drove this car hard through twisty mountain roads and fast on desert interstates. Time and miles have taken their toll, but that is what it was built to do. Imagine a fully restored, flyable P-51 gathering dust or flying only circles at safe altitudes and speeds. Makes me sick to even think of it. Fly it as hard as it can be flown until it can't be flown anymore, then put it in a museum. There are already plenty of static warbirds displays, more need to be made flyable.
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Offline LLv34 Jarsci

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #13 on: June 11, 2001, 03:42:00 AM »
9-10th June there was a big Airshow in Finland , Jyväskylä. Luckily anything bigger didn't happen but one Nieuport replica managed to roll over during takeoff. Probably the cause for this little extra was taking off to downwind. Was quite "funny" to watch it bounce from side to side and then veer to right , left wing touched ground and after that the whole plane spun over its left wing, cartwheeling and landing upside down. Luckily the plane was so light so there were only little damage done. (prop of course ...) And the pride of showpilot must have got some scars..  ;) Rest of the show was just fine with F-18 E/F's and Mustang  :)

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Offline Seahawk

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very bad month for Warbirds....
« Reply #14 on: June 11, 2001, 02:14:00 PM »
Leningrad air show......yesterday two L-39s collided there during an aerobatic programm...

 :(  :(  :(