Author Topic: MA Flyers (Read 3378 times)

CurtissP-6EHawk · « **on:** August 05, 2004, 12:53:53 PM »

I wanted to ask those of you that do not fly in the CT.....why? All I am asking is for a simple explination. Maybe also what it would take to get you to fly in the CT if some things could be changed like:
1. Radar Range
2. Icon Range
3. Planes
4. Maps
5. Trash Talk
6. ??????

Thanks,
Hawk

simshell · « **Reply #1 on:** August 05, 2004, 12:59:03 PM »

when TOD hits the floor CT is gone

which will be awhile;)

ok for real i like the MA not just for furball but to win a War some thing that is disliked in the CT

but i would join if you had some people anyway which you dont have

DipStick · « **Reply #2 on:** August 05, 2004, 01:06:56 PM »

About 100+ players at MOST times and players joining the side with lower numbers upon entering. Period.

I flew there other day for the heck of it. Was headed out because the MA was a joke. Joined the low # side was 21 : 10. Grabbed a SpitV, my plane of choice (it appeared all planes were available for some reason).

Head for the coast at 5k, get jumped by numerous 51s, zekes, 109s, etc.. (all high-alt heros). Fend off a few, get a kill or 2 and then have one 51 pileit running from me, after the usual sad boor-n-z attempts anytime I was engaged.

In the meantime his buddies reup in 51s and they tag team me until they get the kill. One of the 51 pilets calls me a dweeb for flying a 'sissyfire' for the "Axis" side. LOL .. boy now there's some real action and (superior pilets). Needless to say I logged off to play another game.

JB73 · « **Reply #3 on:** August 05, 2004, 01:21:07 PM »

i dont fly the CT because i hate (and i use the word hate here in the worst possible way) reduced icons, and there are a select few planes i like to fly.

190d9
109f4
110g2

i really dislike flying the 110c4b, the 109e, the 190f8

the 190a5 is ok every now and then just to trick a pony into thinking im a dora that cant turn.

there is none of that in the CT... if 190a5's are allowed the enemy knows this.. all you can be in is an A5 not an A8 or a D9 or whatever.

since we dont have the huge ammount of planes that WWII had we have to limit the planeset. if we had modeled the 190a2 a3 a4, and so on, there could be more "fun" in the dogfights.

another thing is a compare the CT to a never ending event in the SEA. i generally dont like those either. fly for an hour looking for a fight, then be suprised by bad intel about the altitude of the enemy, get shot down and you are out. there goes approx 3 hours of my night. not a fun use of time.

yes i like the "gameyness" of the MA, but crossed with the "reality" of events i guess.

there are tooooo many things we can not model in the game like radar operators, full field of view spectrum, so on and so on... because we cant do it like the real war, why do it half baked is sort of my thinking. i dont mean that in a rude way, but i see no real answer to the problems.

like radar (to bring it up again) we have dot dar to simulate a radar operator relaying position of possible enemies. CT "realists" want to get rid of all radar. well then where do you fly? if i am in a game (very important aspect here game) and i want to attack you, where do i go?

do i follow the historically accurate place, knowing full well you knwo im going there? not in a million years. i want my mission to be sucessful, so i go somewhere strategically insignificant (beacuse there is no real lives or anything on the line).

since pushing the virtual front has no real significance in reward/punishment other than my own thoughts, why "play" like that?

yes this is what AHII TOD will be offering, from what i gather. the difference is there WILL be rewards, and punishment to your actions. then flying in a "historically accurate" way will be worth it, and meaningful. until then sadly it's just not my cup of tea.

dont get me totally wrong, i do some of these things occasionally for a change of pace (maybe 1-2 times a month for a hour or 2) it's just not .. well read above LOL.

one last thought on the CT. i mentioned above the planes i personally like to fly. partly becuase of the squad im in (we fly only german planes). i really dislike flying ijn/raf/usa/russian planes, so that really limits my options in the CT even more.

yeah sometimes i want to "dweeb out" and fly nothing by spit9's and lala's, but thats what our squad "dweeb week" is for. 1 week every 3 months we open the plane set. other than that flying a non german plane intentionally is grounds for ejection from the squad. i wouldn't be representing my CO (a real life friend) and squadmates by flying "whatever" in the CT.

im sorry this is rambling, and incoherent, i hope you read it all and make sence of it...

<>

kevykev56 · « **Reply #4 on:** August 05, 2004, 01:21:30 PM »

I flew for 2 hours in the CT last night. Was fun to start with but soon the other side was down to 2 players. I dont feel like jumping ship everytime the sides are uneven. I want a sense of loyalty at any arena I play in.

answer

#6....Need more players in the arena.
#7....Need a balanced ammount of pilots.
#9....Advertised special nights in the CT to draw pilots in for a
taste of what CT is about...IE Sundays...Let rooks horde
alone!

There is alot of good going on in the CT problem is there isnt alot of instant action for players to want to make the change. I will keep making my way in there nightly until the numbers in the MA stabilize, or I start enjoying the CT better than the MA.

RHIN0

SlapShot · « **Reply #5 on:** August 05, 2004, 01:23:46 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by DipStick
About 100+ players at MOST times and players joining the side with lower numbers upon entering. Period.

I flew there other day for the heck of it. Was headed out because the MA was a joke. Joined the low # side was 21 : 10. Grabbed a SpitV, my plane of choice (it appeared all planes were available for some reason).

Head for the coast at 5k, get jumped by numerous 51s, zekes, 109s, etc.. (all high-alt heros). Fend off a few, get a kill or 2 and then have one 51 pileit running from me, after the usual sad boor-n-z attempts anytime I was engaged.

In the meantime his buddies reup in 51s and they tag team me until they get the kill. One of the 51 pilets calls me a dweeb for flying a 'sissyfire' for the "Axis" side. LOL .. boy now there's some real action and (superior pilets). Needless to say I logged off to play another game.

That almost mirrors my last experience in the CT. It was nothing more that a smaller verison of the MA as far as I was concerned.

Dead Man Flying · « **Reply #6 on:** August 05, 2004, 01:41:28 PM »

Fix the radar and icon ranges, and you'll probably see at least a small increase in the numbers. The CT has far fewer people in it than the MA, but sometimes it seems that the fights are twice as difficult to find. Why? It's faux realism for its own sake IMO. Make it a microcosm of the MA; MA settings but with interesting new maps and historical plane setups every week. I'd go for that.

You also have to overcome the collective action problem where players like flying against lots of other players. Since the CT never seems capable of fielding enough players, few want to fly there. As such, the numbers remain low and perpetuate the fact that nobody wants to go there. I'm not sure how you're going to overcome that one by tweaking arena settings.

-- Todd/Leviathn

Arlo · « **Reply #7 on:** August 05, 2004, 01:45:24 PM »

Alternate plan is to get someone to trip over the MA's cable once or twice a night.

B17Skull12 · « **Reply #8 on:** August 05, 2004, 01:51:18 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Arlo
Alternate plan is to get someone to trip over the MA's cable once or twice a night.

J00 AR3 T3H SMART!!!!1

Edbert · « **Reply #9 on:** August 05, 2004, 01:54:39 PM »

Good question Curtiss.

1st off I am going to assume (knowing the risk of doing that) that there was something wrong with the CT and having all planes available to both sides here. What Dipstick describes is anethma to much of what I like about the CT.

I prefer the CT in almost all aspects more than the MA except for one and that is the number of targets/friends in the arena. I think that if you could solve that one you'd have a winner. I also agree that when TOD gets released it will largely obviate the need for a CT.

I am not so naive as to think that I am in line with the majority opinion on the CT being better than the MA as far as arena settings go and all that, but let me explain just a few of my reasons.

1.) You almost never hear the "quit running and fight" stuff in there. Why? Because the aircraft in the setup are pretty evenly matched (unless you are there on jet-week), particularly so when compared to the MA. You simply do not have to didge your 1944-45 B&Zers when you are flying in a 1941-42 aircraft.

2.) Partially becasue of the above point, I see more good " dogfights" in one night of CT flying than I usually do in a week of MA flying. Evenly matched planes are conducive to that.

3.) I prefer reduced icon range. Have you ever looked at a car at 1 mile away and tried to tell if it was blue or black or grey much less what the make and model was? How about 3 miles away? Have you ever been to the airport and tried to tell the difference between a twin engine plane and a single from more than a mile away? I'm not advocating removing icons just those at extreme ranges. You can still see dots at extreme range, you just cannot tell what model of aircraft is closing at what rate until they get closer.

4.) Radar too, whenever my country loses dar (a nightly occurence lately) I find I spend more time scanning the sky than trash talking on ch200. I know some will say just turn off icons or turn off dar but I am after increased realism here not unfair advantages for my enemy.

5.) Trash talking is definitely less in the CT. I think one reason is because of all the points above. Folks are not feeling the frustration of trying to fight a P51 with a Hurri or a Dora with a P40. Folks are busy scanning for incoming enemies and don't spend the whole climbout talkin smack while letting the dot-dar tell them if a con is close or not. The overall level of trash talking might increase if the CT ever posted significant numbers but for now it is generally pleasant and cordial. On a per capita basis there are MANY more salutes given, partly becasue most kills are earned not cherried.

6.) I like flying a wide variety of planes, and there are many I'd like to try to learn better but unfoirtunately many of the ones I want to try to learn are simply dead meat in the MA.

I want to encourage anyone who has not given the CT a serious try to do so. Particularly when the MA has no dar or your side is getting banged by a horde. But to answer the original question there's only one thing that will make me fly the CT more and thats the number of players in the CT, a nasty catch-22 I realize, but its the truth.

Karnak · « **Reply #10 on:** August 05, 2004, 02:19:23 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Edbert MOL
3.) I prefer reduced icon range. Have you ever looked at a car at 1 mile away and tried to tell if it was blue or black or grey much less what the make and model was? How about 3 miles away? Have you ever been to the airport and tried to tell the difference between a twin engine plane and a single from more than a mile away? I'm not advocating removing icons just those at extreme ranges. You can still see dots at extreme range, you just cannot tell what model of aircraft is closing at what rate until they get closer.

It sounds to me like you need glasses, or new glasses if you already have them.

The color of an automobile (much smaller than even the smallest WWII fighter) is easy to see at a mile.

Telling a twin engined aircraft from a single engined aircraft at two miles doesn't even require concentration. It is simply casual data.

More to the point, I can tell if a single engined aircraft at three or four miles is getting closer or farther away whereas in AH I cannot without the icons.

I do agree that more graduated information would be better.

As to the question.

I hate dot chasing.

The radar in AH is greatly more reliable than WWII radar, but provides significantly less data at shorter ranges. It is in fact so flawed as to make a BoB scenario using it pointless and you might as well hand the Germans the victory.

The stealth 4AM land grabs where the Lufties then declare Sea Lion a sucess is annoying BS as the RAF is never equiped with aircraft capable of retaking any ground.

Being vulched because few people ever seems to want to play the Japanese, but rather wants to recreate "The Marianas Turkey Shoot" feels lie the MA. If the Japanese do get equal numbers and put up a fight we are then treated to a long whine about how the Japanese have it too easy in the CT Forum and how Japanese aircraft really sucked.

Many of the setups are very odd in their choice of aircraft. Freely available Fw190D-9s (700 built) and Bf109G-10 (really a Bf109K-4 and relatively few built) completely eliminates any historical immersion.

Spitfire hatred. How can you have an arena that claims to be historical matches and then do everthing possible to avoind putting the Spitfire in setups where it was? The same can be said for the F4U.

kevykev56 · « **Reply #11 on:** August 05, 2004, 02:23:01 PM »

Quote

Alternate plan is to get someone to trip over the MA's cable once or twice a night.

No need to pull the plug...just limit the # of players to 400 in the MA. Overflow will fall into the CT and maybe attract new players.

RHIN0

JB73 · « **Reply #12 on:** August 05, 2004, 02:45:47 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Karnak
I hate dot chasing.

that pretty much sums up 1/2 my post LMAO... i need to be more concise and simple when i post LOL

peregrin · « **Reply #13 on:** August 05, 2004, 03:21:17 PM »

I've never flown in the CT, for the simple reason that anytime I've looked it's had 20 pilots or less. Last time I looked was an evening when knights were outnumered 2-1 by rooks, had 5 fields all vulched etc., so I thought I'd try the CT and there were 3, thats right 3 pilots up.

--Peregrine.

Arlo · « **Reply #14 on:** August 05, 2004, 03:53:42 PM »

9pm central time. Drop on in. If things ain't porked there's a party planned. 262s (at one base perked @ 75). 190a5s as well as most of the late war Luftwaffe rides (for those who prefer non jets). Both ponies, all the Jugs, the dirty ape and the Hog D as well as Fortresses and Marauders inbound to wreak havoc.

The CT banner links to a site with the details. This one:

http://www.jollyrogers.info/Combat_Theater.html

Edited: Whoops - thought the Jets were free - nm. Tigers cost 25.