Author Topic: big upgrade planned...need advice (Read 804 times)

Kev367th · « **Reply #15 on:** August 10, 2004, 04:15:12 AM »

PCI-E may be the future, but there is not ONE game or application that can even come close to using the theoretical bandwidth. In fact the AGPx8 bus is not even close to being saturated yet. I get a horrible feeling it will be another lots of promises (AGP 4 -> 8), and not much in reality. PCI-E will really come into its own for NICs, etc. No other reason at moment or near to mid future to have it.
By the time PCI-E is widely used or maybe even utilised it will be time for yet another upgrade.
For e.g. with the X800 and 6800 series video cards 95% of people will be CPU limited, the AGP bus just isn't near to being fully utilised.

Edbert · « **Reply #16 on:** August 10, 2004, 07:52:37 AM »

I'm certainly CPU and FSB constrained now. My main rig is a 2100+ with a 9800-pro-256. The MB is an Asus but only supports AGP4x. I put the 9800 in replacing the Ti4600 and only got a VERY small bump in frame rates.

Ironically enough my laptop is a 3.4HT with 800/400 FSB, a Gig of RAM, and a 9700pro-128 with AGP8x. But driver support for mobile graphics cards still sucks

I can get decent frames with AH but don't like the 16inch wide screen (used to a 21) and Doom3 plays well but locks up hard after 5-10 minutes. Debugs indicate video driver issues, sigh.

Well, if I give up on the $500 PCI-E video card that gives me more moola to blow on a CPU/MB combo. Maybe I'll splurge for the FX53 then and just stick it out with the 9800pro for a while. That sound like a good idea to you?

Kev367th · « **Reply #17 on:** August 10, 2004, 02:52:53 PM »

Personally I'd go with the FX53 (you won't be dissappointed), at least until PCI-E is more established and is going to be utilised to its full potential. Only real advantage I have seen is running 2 PCI-E cards with something similar to the old voodoo SLI connection. You fancy forking out for 2 PCI-E vid cards?
Or get an Athlon 64 3800 (s939) and an nVidia 6800, at least some games are appearing that use shader 3.

AWMac · « **Reply #18 on:** August 10, 2004, 05:53:08 PM »

Bloom I went back and did as you suggest with the exception of Athlon 64 3000+ CPU on a board because they didn't offer it for the pickens. If I dropped the MOBO/CPU what MOBO/CPU do you suggest that would go with what I'm configuring?

AWMac · « **Reply #19 on:** August 10, 2004, 06:13:57 PM »

AMD Athlon Barton 3000+ 2.167 GHz 333Mhz BUS 512.

ASUS A7N8X-X NFORCE2 DDR400, 8XAGP, Sound, Lan, USB 2.0

512Mb PC 2700 DDR333

ATI Radeon 9600PRO 128MB DDR 8X AGP dual head. tv out.

80.0GB Western Digital 7200RPM UDMA100 8m Cache.

Optorite 52x24x52 CDRW Drive

Sound Blaster Live 5.1 Digital.

Nikao Black Neon 400W ATX Case w/sidewindow & front USB

Case Fan 80 mm DC fan

Black Windows Keyboard. 104 key, PS/2.

Black 2-Button Wheel Mouse, PS/2

Victory 2.1 3-Piece Subwoofer System Black

Microsoft Windows XP Home.

Price now is $ 902.00

They didn't offer a Athlon 64 3000+ CPU on a board.

What ASUS MOBO would you recommend for the AMD 64 3000+ ?

I can drop the AMD Athlon Barton 3000+ 2.167 GHz 333Mhz BUS 512.
and
ASUS A7N8X-X NFORCE2 DDR400, 8XAGP, Sound, Lan, USB 2.0 and maybe go with a AMD 64 3000+ and MOBO.

Open for suggestions.

AWMac · « **Reply #20 on:** August 10, 2004, 06:44:08 PM »

Aberdeeninc.com

ASUS K8V-SE DELUXE, Socket 754 for Athlon 64: $137.00

AMD Athlon 64 3000+: $240.99

Total $377.99
............................. ............................. ...
MagicMicro.com

ASUS K8VDX K8T800, DDR400, SATA, Sound, LAN, USB 2.0 : $139.00

AMD Athlon 64 3000+ 64 Bit 1150k Cache
: $185.00

Total $324.00

............................. ............................

NewEgg.com

ASUS "K8V SE Deluxe" K8T800 Chipset Motherboard for AMD Socket 754 CPU -RETAIL $146.00

AMD Athlon 64 3000+, 512KB L2 Cache 64-bit Processor - Retail : $175.00

Total: $32100.

bloom25 · « **Reply #21 on:** August 10, 2004, 11:47:43 PM »

AWMac, if you've got the extra $200 to do it, that Athlon 64 board and CPU would be a good 20% faster than the 3000+ Athlon XP. (It also has a lot more onboard goodies and upgradability.) The only other thing that should be changed for best performance if you go with an Athlon 64 would be to move from DDR333 to DDR400 memory. I'd probably go with a single 512 MB stick.

If you don't have the money, your second list of parts with the Athlon XP is using a motherboard I've used many times and have had good luck with. It doesn't come with anything but the essentials in the box, but it is a good inexpensive and proven board. I will say that the cost you came up with seems high to me though... Is that an OEM copy of XP Home, or the retail box? If you go with the OEM version it should only cost about $90. The catch is that Microsoft does not provide free tech support to OEM copies of their software, but considering that their phone tech support people tend to be less than helpful most of the time, I don't think it's a big loss.

If you are really on a really tight budget, the A7N8X-X has onboard sound. (Though I'd say the sound quality it delivers is only mediocre. I find that it sounds a bit "muddy" in the midrange and very tinny.) You could always add a better soundcard later on.

Schutt · « **Reply #22 on:** August 11, 2004, 08:23:23 AM »

That sounds ok, i have pretty similar equipment (MB/CPU/RAM/GCARD) stuffed in my old pc and to me it runs AH2 nicely, going on 1024 with all qualities turned up to full and texture size of 512.

Frames are usually above 35, but with ah2 i have a hard time measureing performance since the fps varry a lot.
Anyone has a idea of how to test framerate in ah2 in a compairable way?

Mine is

Asus A7n8x-e deluxe
Athlon barton 3000+ 400mhz fsb (2100mhz)
Infinion PC3200 CL3 512MB ram x2
Noname ATI 9600 256mb
NoName 450W PSU
xp prof

My Grafik card is slower than yours but with more ram. AH2 preloads the textures in the grafik ram, uses 144mb of it, i have no idea what impact in performance is there, but if you care i can try switch of preload.

AH2 displays 440mb of ram used... well below 512.. so having 512MB of ram should have no impact on ah2 performance compared to having 1GB

My motherboard has dual channel ram controller, not sure if the X has that too. This gives a little boost with 2 ram modules, i have no data on the athlon64 ram transfer performance but i guess its better.

400mhz fsb should be a bit faster than 333 but it is a lot more trouble since it does not work with every ram module.

Bottom line i think your system should be good in ah2, since mine runs it good too. When you run in 1280 res it might be diffrent, have to check that myself sometime.

ciao schutt

Edbert · « **Reply #23 on:** August 11, 2004, 08:36:34 AM »

Mac, you could save "some" cash by not buying a keyboard, mouse, windowed case, CDRW, etc. I know every little bit counts and the money you save with accessories could allow you to try and get the 64bit version. My own way of doing it is to spend big on the core and save money on the extra stuff.

...just a thought.

Kev367th · « **Reply #24 on:** August 11, 2004, 04:55:08 PM »

If you do get an Athlon make sure you get a socket 939 3500 or 3800. The socket 754 version are being phased out.
Good board for socket 939 is ASUS A8V.
Socket 939 are dual channel so you will need 2 sticks DDR400 CAS2 memory.

Edbert · « **Reply #25 on:** August 17, 2004, 03:06:32 PM »

Well I did it, just jumped off the financial cliff so to speak. Last weekend I got a special deal on an AGP version of the X800XT-256 for $416. Today I just ordered an A8V with an FX53 and a full Gig of DDR400 RAM. Now all I need is a new power supply and a water-cooling kit (for over clocking). Maybe I'll finally be able to run Doom3 in full res and IL2/FB/AEP in perfect mode.

AH2 will be liquid for sure.

I'm so excited, I feel like a kid on Christmas morning!