Author Topic: Range ICON = handicapped gameplay & spray (Read 3618 times)

Citabria · « **on:** March 30, 2000, 08:34:00 PM »

(note: this is not a complaint about "ICONs" used for identification)

My Suggestion:

No Range Icons whatsoever.

OR...
Range Icons only for 300 yards in as a compromise between the current range icons and none at all.

Anyone here ever stood close to the tracks of an oncoming train?
its closure rate is hard to see

the same is true with aircraft but to a higher degree than the train.
(trust me I fly in heavily congested airspace every day

)

Is this request unreasonable?

We Must ask ourselves the side effects of NOT having RANGE ICONS.

1. If no range meter was there would you get much closer to fire?
2. Will long range shooting become more difficult?
3. Will pilots need to aquire a "skill" at determining distance of aircraft by their size?
4. Will Identification of enemy aircraft be affected? (no

)
5. Will dogfights be harder to find? (no, ID icon unchanged

)

Obviously the benifits of not having Range Icons are the same as the side effects.

Either way its worth a try

Who knows... You may never want them again once flying and fighting without them.

I used to fly a lot of SL and HA in warbirds, when range icons were not present I was much less likely to fire at long ranges.
I'm not saying range Icons help all that much but they do give the shooter a level of comfort and confidence in his aiming solution that would never be present in real life thus resulting in much spray n pray and gnashing of teeth.

However the range indicator is an extremely good measure of the bandits closure and E state... thus it takes a mighty chunk of the guesswork out of the fight artificially.

I'm all for more difficult shooting at any distance past point blank and up close and personal

and it's my personal opinion that this will make long range gunnery more difficult instead of artificially limiting the weapons effectiveness ranges. If implemented we will no doubt see sights calibrated to certain ranges and wingspans.

please comment. I may be going off on a rabbit trail here and would like to here everyones opinion on the matter

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CitabriAirbatiC

"There Is No Spoon"

[This message has been edited by Citabria (edited 03-31-2000).]

Kieren · « **Reply #1 on:** March 30, 2000, 08:50:00 PM »

Speaking as an experienced player, I like the idea.

If I was new... I dunno. Right now it is easy to pound into a newbies head "don't fire until 400". I suppose it is possible to say "let the plane fill the sights" but it is harder that way...

Citabria · « **Reply #2 on:** March 30, 2000, 09:29:00 PM »

we would never again have to listen to someone complaing:

"I was d1.2 and flying away straight and level and they hit me"

once inside d1 the range indicator is screaming at both the shooter and the target in 999. 899. 898. 795. 400... 355.. 200 etc

I'm old fashioned I guess.
I prefer to guess instead of know the way they really had to back then

Hristo · « **Reply #3 on:** March 30, 2000, 09:36:00 PM »

How about a trial period at least ?

skeet · « **Reply #4 on:** March 30, 2000, 09:45:00 PM »

Hi
Agreed - love to do away with longer ranges - if you have minimal net lag.
If you do have bad net lag as we often do down here (in NZ) if you don't start an evasive manouver when someone is 1.6 or 1.8+
or last night 2.4+ away (!) I might as well just forget it and fly straight and level. In fact it seems to me that's what they're FE think's I am doing anyway :-)
If I don't even have that clue I am flying worse than blind.

------------------
skeet - out
Aces High - Fight Stimulator

Citabria · « **Reply #5 on:** March 30, 2000, 09:58:00 PM »

indeed the element of the unkown would be much more significant

I know I would bite my nerves much more on when to jink if I did not know the bandits precise distance (d1.2) and closure (200.5mph)

works both ways though

ok I'm gonna shudup now, you know I'm for it

cheers

Batmann · « **Reply #6 on:** March 30, 2000, 10:01:00 PM »

Plane icon is necessary to distinguish enemies at Main Arena. But, range icon must not be necessary. Actual pilots measured a distance compared with size of aircraft and ring of OPL gun sight. So, they mistook a distance about big birds sometimes. We have range icon and never mistook. It may not be realistic.

------------------
Batmann <CO/JG68> from Tokyo, Japan
JG68 Briefing Room
"Anybody who is Japanese and likes German aircrafts
can't but get to like Ki-61."

Maniac · « **Reply #7 on:** March 31, 2000, 12:59:00 AM »

Im all for not having the range icons, leave the plane type icons but get rid of the range icons.

If this aint doable (is that an word?

) then get rid of the range icon above d3-d5...

------------------
AH : Maniac
WB : -nr-1-

http://www.rsaf.org/osf/

[This message has been edited by Maniac (edited 03-31-2000).]

hblair · « **Reply #8 on:** March 31, 2000, 01:17:00 AM »

Preach on brother citabria.

Glad to see there are allies from the WB's HA active in these Bulletin Boards.

ezrust · « **Reply #9 on:** March 31, 2000, 01:31:00 AM »

I really like this idea. In Real Life (TM) the gunsights were adjustable in that the circle could be narrowed or widened to match a plane type's wing size at a certain distance. If you had the thing sized for a Spitfire at 300 feet and the plane filled half the sight you could guess he was 600 feet away. "Fill the sight" means wait until D300 (if that was where the sight was set). We would still be able to guess the plane's distance by how much it fills our sight. Obviously plane types vary in size but I don't think it would take long to get used to.

Ghosth · « **Reply #10 on:** March 31, 2000, 02:14:00 AM »

I mostly agree, with one caveat.
When someone is bounceing you from above the ONLY chance you have is to know when to split s. At 1k (just inside long gun range) that plane is still a speck if he's diveing at you.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying don't try it. But be carefull what you ask for.

I too spent my time in the HA & to a lesser amount the SL's. I would love to see reduced icons/ranges. But the flight model is so much tighter that eveasive manuvers inside 1k are pretty tough as is. Without some idea of distance bounces are going to get real nasty.

But hey, I'm game if you can talk them into trying it.

------------------
Maj Ghosth
XO 332nd Flying Mongrels

Maniac · « **Reply #11 on:** March 31, 2000, 04:44:00 AM »

Ghostt,

U know that theres an zoom feture right?

Regards.

------------------
AH : Maniac
WB : -nr-1-

http://www.rsaf.org/osf/

CANNON · « **Reply #12 on:** March 31, 2000, 05:01:00 AM »

The only thing i miss from that other sim is the kill message system. Everything else here is better.

Vermillion · « **Reply #13 on:** March 31, 2000, 06:25:00 AM »

Ok, I will be the first nay sayer here.

How about it? Not for me.

If you want a special no icon arena, fine, but lets not try to convert the main.

<starts kicking the dead horse>

The graphics we use, in no way give the same amount of information that real life <tm> does to estimate distances.

We use a squished 90 degree field of view, displayed on a 15-17 inch monitor on average, and use video cards that display no where near the number of colors that the human eye can differentiate.

Sorry, but I don't want to spend my time with my nose literally stuck to my monitor trying to figure out what a black speck is, when in life you could immediately tell what it is.

------------------
Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
Carpe Jugulum
"Real Men fly Radials, Nancy Boys fly Spitfires"

Maniac · « **Reply #14 on:** March 31, 2000, 06:29:00 AM »

Verm,

Yup you are perhaps correct, HTC needs to better the graphics on the long range cons, in that other sim it was no problem identifying the dots at long range.

Regards.

------------------
AH : Maniac
WB : -nr-1-

http://www.rsaf.org/osf/

Author Topic: Range ICON = handicapped gameplay & spray (Read 3618 times)

skeet

Batmann

ezrust

CANNON