Kerry to Bush: Bring it on!

[Gunslinger]

Originally posted by rpm371
Grunslinger, keep chanting that republican mantra. It does not change the facts.

WHAT FACTS.......you have not given me ONE FACT that these adds are funded or supported by the RNC or any other major player in the republican party.

the only thing remotly republican I've heard of these adds were that a republican who is a media conglomerate or somthing gave these guys a bunch of money.  That's it.

Put up or shut up!

[Toad]

I doubt you've posted a true "fact" in this thread as yet RPM.

The way you continually denigrate Guard service puts you right on the level of those you rant against in my book.

[Toad]

Now for something germane to the campaign.

Hey, did you guys see that Kerry blasted Bush's plan to withdraw troops from Korea?

And did you seen on the news the clip of Kerry in an ABC interview (I think it was ABC) a week or so earlier telling the reporter that Kerryy thought we should be looking at pulling troops out of Korea?

So what do you think of that? How about some current events?

Kerry says we should be looking at pulling troops out of Korea one week and the next week he's blasting Bush for planning to pull troops out of Korea.

You think he's just pandering for votes maybe? Say anything to get elected? That he has no real plan other than "I'm not Bush" and "I don't really know what I'm going to do." ?

So what do you think RPM?

[X2Lee]

Originally posted by rpm371
Grunslinger, keep chanting that republican mantra. It does not change the facts.

Ya know what? Kerry hurt hisself bad. Not ANY of the folks I have talked to in the last month knew anything about Kerrys VN record
Not one had heard ANYTHING bad about Kerrys record

Welp everyone will hear about it now its all over the news and on Nightline tonight.
Whether or not he served honorably or not millions will hear about it now.

[Dago]

I hope Kerry doesnt run into 3 questions or challenges he has trouble with, he will run away from the dangerous chance of another tough one.  It is his pattern.

dago

[Saurdaukar]

Originally posted by rpm371
You actually believe the Bush campaign had NOTHING to do with the ads? Get real.

Now were shifting from 'facts' to 'belief?'

[Gunslinger]

RPM:  "but...but....duh...I...I...um ....huh"

running short on actual facts????????????

I could do what librals do:  Completly ignore what you said about bush and bring up Moveon.org's add that compared Bush to hitler and how that is 10Xs worse than what the swift boat ads do.  

(CRICKETS)

[anonymous]

it would be a great debate. bush jr a fighter pilot who only claimed to be a fighter pilot. kerry a small boat oic who claimed to be a war criminal along with all us forces in vn. funny i thought it was us immunizing the kids and the nlf assassinating school teacher hamlet leader and everyone who not agree to become bullet stoppers for nlf when they egress thru village after hit and run attack. and no slam on surface warfare os but its a heck of a lot tougher to become a fighter pilot than it is to become a surface warfare o. rpm take off the blinders. dems should have gone with liberman. i know you may find it hard to believe but plenty of guys in military hate kerry not because hes a dem candidiot for cic but because hes a lying traitor to every guy who served in vn. that debate will never happen because there are two questions bush could ask that would crucify kerry on natl tv. and there wouldnt be a swarm of dem spinsters to control the damage before it was to late.

[Gunslinger]

tic......toc.......tic....... ..toc.........tic.........toc ...(pin drop)...tic.....toc.....

[rpm]

Originally posted by Gunslinger
RPM:  "but...but....duh...I...I...um ....huh"

running short on actual facts????????????

I could do what librals do:  Completly ignore what you said about bush and bring up Moveon.org's add that compared Bush to hitler and how that is 10Xs worse than what the swift boat ads do.  

(CRICKETS)

Because I do not live and breathe to watch this board every second and actually fly Aces High for a few hours does not mean you are correct Grunslinger.

The FACT that the man Kerry pulled from the water said they were under fire and every time he surfaced small arms fire was hitting near him.

The FACT that Swift Boat Blah Blah Blah is funded by republican money.

The FACT that the president won't denounce what they're up to tells you everything that you need to know — he wants them to do his dirty work.

The FACT that Navy documents contradict Thurlow's account.

The FACT that Thurlow accepted awards for the same engagement and did not refute the story then.

The FACT that Swift Boat Blah Blah Blah is run by the same group that tried to smear John McCain's military service.

How's that for facts? Tick, tick, tick....(crickets)

[Gunslinger]

yet you never ONCE mentioned a FACT or backed it up in your nice list of "facts".  I wasnt disputing what happend in vietnam almost 40 years ago.  I was disputing the assumption on your part that the republicans are behind the adds and called you on it.

You still have yet to show me any credible evidence that anyone involved in these adds are in fact linked to the Bush campaign.

Dont get mad at me......I'm not the one that had diarea of the mouth and not be able to back up my statement.

BTW...bush has come out against these adds as well as all other 527 group adds.  Even if he told them to stop they'd still be running.

[anonymous]

Originally posted by rpm371
Because I do not live and breathe to watch this board every second and actually fly Aces High for a few hours does not mean you are correct Grunslinger.

The FACT that the man Kerry pulled from the water said they were under fire and every time he surfaced small arms fire was hitting near him.

The FACT that Swift Boat Blah Blah Blah is funded by republican money.

The FACT that the president won't denounce what they're up to tells you everything that you need to know — he wants them to do his dirty work.

The FACT that Navy documents contradict Thurlow's account.

The FACT that Thurlow accepted awards for the same engagement and did not refute the story then.

The FACT that Swift Boat Blah Blah Blah is run by the same group that tried to smear John McCain's military service.

How's that for facts? Tick, tick, tick....(crickets)

the swifties for the truth are a 527 group just like the far more insane and evil moveon.org. if there was any link between them and republican campaign funds they could be very harshly disciplined. face it dude kerry is an opportunistic liar. you cant play "america is evil i know im jane fondas sweetheart technician" in the seventies and all of a sudden become "mr stereotypical vn vet hero just whats needed in the whitehouse" and not have anyone with half a brain call you on it. whats your opinion on kerry stating that military service doesnt matter for president when he was defending bills run for pres but now its a lynchpin. and explain the perjury before the senate for me as well.

[rpm]

Here's a few more FACTS about Swift Boat Blah Blah Blah.

Narrator: "Here's what these men think about John Kerry."

FACT: None of the Following Speakers in This Ad Served on Either of Kerry's Two SWIFT Boats (PCF44 & PCF94). Absolutely NONE of these men served on John Kerry's SWIFT boats in Vietnam. Some of them were in Vietnam at the same time, some of them did serve on SWIFT boats but none of them were on John Kerry's SWIFT boat.

George Elliott: "John Kerry has not been honest about what happened in Vietnam."

FACT: George Elliott was NOT a crewmate of John Kerry's. In a campaign speech FOR Kerry he said: "The fact that he chased an armed enemy down is not something not to be looked down upon but it was an act of courage. And the whole outfit served with honor..."[T]here was no question that it was above and beyond anything that we had seen down there in that case at that time frame...It just so happened that this one was so outstanding that the Silver Star was eventually awarded." [Kerry Press Conference, 10/27/96]

Al French: "He is lying about his record."

FACT: Al French was NOT a crewmate of John Kerry's. He has no evidence to back his accusations.

Louis Letson: "I know John Kerry is lying about his first purple heart, because I treated him for that injury."

FACT: Louis Letson, Now Part of the Republican Veterans Efforts to Smear Kerry, WAS NOT the Doctor That Signed Kerry's Sick Call Sheet and Was NOT a Kerry Crewmate. Despite Letson's claims to have treated Kerry, he is not listed on any document as having treated Kerry after the 12/2/68 firefight. Offering only an account of dates and places-which is readily available in Kerry's biography and media accounts-Letson has produced nothing to verify his treatment of Kerry.

Van O'Dell:"John Kerry lied to get his Bronze Star. I know. I was there. I saw what happened."

FACT: Van O'Dell was NOT a crewmate of John Kerry's. John Kerry was nominated for the Bronze Star by James Rassmann and eyewitness accounts, official naval documents and independent analyses all state that Kerry and his crew were under fire on the day in question.

[rpm]

Jack Chenowith: "His account of what happened and what actually happened are the difference between night and day."

FACT: Jack Chenowith was NOT a crewmate of John Kerry's. Its Not Kerry's Account on the Bronze Star Citation-It's the Account of the U.S. Navy, Admiral Elmo Zumwalt Commander U.S. Naval Forces in Vietnam and backed up by Presidential Historian Douglas Brinkley, James Rassmann and the Crewmate of PCF-44 & PCF 94.

Roy Hoffman: "John Kerry has not been honest."

FACT: Roy Hoffmann was NOT a crewmate of John Kerry's. "Hoffman acknowledged he had no first-hand knowledge to discredit Kerry's claims to valor and said that although Kerry was under his command, he really didn't know Kerry much personally." [Milwaukee Journal Sentinel, 5/7/04]

Adrian Lonsdale:  "He lacks the capacity to lead"

FACT:  Adrian Lonsdale was NOT a crewmate of John Kerry's. While campaigning FOR Kerry in 1996 he said "As far as I was concerned, the war was won over there in that part for that period. And it was mainly won because of the bravado and the courage of the young officers that ran the boats, the SWIFT boats and the Coast Guard cutters and Senator Kerry was no exception." [Kerry for Senate Press Conference, 10/27/96]

Larry Thurlow: "When the chips were down, you could not count on John Kerry."

FACT: Larry Thurlow was NOT a crewmate of John Kerry's. On the day Kerry pulled Rassmann from the water, "Larry Thurlow had maneuvered his PCF-51 over by this time and he hopped aboard PCF-3 to offer assistance. The boat was in shambles but they were still shooting too hard to assess any damage" "BOATS RECEIVED HEAVY A/W [automatic weapons] & S/A [small arms] FROM BOTH BANKS…ALL BOATS AND MSF RETURNED FIRE…PCF-94 [Kerry's boat] PICKED UP MSF ADVISOR WHO WENT OVERBOARD…PCF-94 TOWED PCF-3." [Tour of Duty, Brinkley, 2004, p. 314; U.S. Navy After Action Report]

Bob Elder: "John Kerry is no war hero."

FACT:  Bob Elder was NOT a crewmate of John Kerry's. John Kerry recieved the Silver Star, Bronze Star and 3 Purple Hearts.

Shelton White: "John Kerry betrayed the men and women he served with in Vietnam."

Joe Ponder: "He dishonored his country. He most certainly did."

Grant Hibbard: "He betrayed all his shipmates. He lied before the Senate.

FACTS: White, Ponder and Hibbard were NOT crewmates of John Kerry.
When pressed by conservative talk show host Sean Hannity, retired General and Former Commander in Chief of Central Command, Tommy Franks believed Kerry's summary of what other soldiers had told him about unfortunate actions by a few U.S. soldiers in Vietnam: "I'm not sure that -- that activities like that didn't take place. In fact, quite the contrary. I'm sure that they did." [Fox News, Hannity & Colmes, 8/3/04]

In April of 2004, the Toledo Blade was awarded the Pulitzer Prize for their series detailing the atrocities committed by a few American soldiers in Vietnam. The series was based upon the Tiger Force which operated for several months in the Central Highlands of Vietnam.

Bon Hildreth: "I served with John Kerry. John Kerry cannot be trusted."

FACT: Bob Hildreth was NOT a crewmate of John Kerry's. But Jim Wasser Was: "If John Kerry came to us and said he had one more mission and we're going to hell, he'd have a full crew" -- Jim Wasser [Dallas Morning News, 7/29/04]


tick,tick,tick...

[GRUNHERZ]

Nobody who wasnt on Kerry's boat every second of their service was ever really in Vietnam and they have no clue what they talking about!!!!