NATEDOG.. F4U1-C... I'll take one to go with fries and large coke!

[Gator]

I'm a bit dismayed that, with the game needing so many more planes, it was decided to include a plane which had a measly production run of 200 in the game..particularly with no RPS or usage restrictions.

   FWIW, I'm with Torgo ...

[Hristo]

There is no doubt that this plane will be used very much. Especially in first days after it gets introduced.

AH still has considerbale bunch of pure HOers that simply drool for a plane like that  

The percentage of that ugly thing in the arena will surely be higher than it was in WW2.

However, bring it in. But don't provide LW with old desings like early 109s. We want something rare too. You know what that is  

[AKDejaVu]

I wonder how many pilots dislike the F4u-1D in the arena right now because its guns are too wimpy?  How many more dislike it because it has no rear visibility, is a horrible turner, doesn't climb well... and has too many other issues to list.

Adding the cannons will make it a little more lethal.  People will want to fly it at first to see how lethal it is.  They will quickly discover it doesn't matter how powerful the cannons are... you still have to get the enemy in the sites to get a kill.

Ass for buff hunting... wouldn't that be a pitty to have to have escorts when you fly a solo buff to destroy an entire base?

So, regardless of how powerfull the canons are... or how many/few were made.. this plane is not going to rule the arena. It won't even be a distant 3rd.  Allow the F4u faithfull to have their one wish and fly with cannons.  They've endured long enough and are somewhat deserving for all they've had to put up with.

AKDejaVu

[drdoyo]

Torgo,

I'd RATHER see the REAL history makers, Birdcage -1, and the -1A, 3 tone paint schemes and all !! AND for those that cry about the bombs, unless the field built rack was installed, these versions did not carry a bomb worth more than a paper weight. No water injection on the -1 either.

------------------
Drdoyo, Lt.
VF-17 the Jolly Rogers
8X

[Duckwing6]

HOG !

'nuff said  8)


------------------
Phillip "Duckwing6" Artweger
Flight Officer "E" Flight
Skeleton Crew

[dolomite]

Torgo-

Obviously I mispoke.

When I say exotic, it is in two contxts:

1.) From the currently modeled in any sim aspect, and;

2.) Future possibilities of little known/used aircraft.

I like the representing of history as well as anyone. Would I like to see a Hawk 75 vs. A5M match-up? You bet! Anyone seen it somewhere? Neither plane is exotic in the historic sense, but point to a sim that models them. P63? Not exotic, until you find someone modeling it. That is my point.  

AH isn't WB or AW or FA, nor should it strive to be IMHO. You have a valid point of view, basing all entries relative to their numeric production. Still, that will give us basically WB/AW/FA all over again, won't it?

....and for early, early war, the IAR-80 would be fine...

[spinny]

Duh. Just noticed that we have the N1K2-J...Baugher indicates only 415 of the beauties were produced. BTW, in English, Shiden is Violet Lightening...lovely name.

------------------
Spinny, VF-17, The Jolly Rogers 8X

[Rocket]

As a dedicated Hawg driver I am glad to see a variant out there.  I figured the 1C would be last thing modeled so imagine my surprise  
Tho I will continue to fly the 1D as my regular ride and maybe the 1C to buff hunt.

As for production numbers phoey on them.  If the plane isn't done in another game or adds flare to the game then make it.  Who cares if 3 aces flew it in WWII.  I can get just about any WWII game and fly the same planes with different FMs.  AH is offering something new out there by getting off the beaten path and giving us some less produced but still great planes.  If it makes it interesting put em in.  I would rather see true to life FM and a real challenge as a SIM then FMs porked down to make it playable.


S!

Rocket

------------------
The Red Dragons
Fierce and Bold
With Honour and Courage
_______________________
www.reddragons.de

[Torgo]

The planes that have been ignored by other games aren't the "less produced" ones..

The Shturmovik had the largest production run EVER for any military AC in any era.

There are all kinds of planes that were produced in many thousands, saw lots of combat, that have yet to be modeled in any sim.

And you have to make a distinction between whole new planes, variants of planes that are REALLY different in game terms, and variants that don't make that much difference in game terms.

If you have plane X that had a 2,000 production run, but in 10 variants that aren't all THAT different, of 200 planes each, then you obviously have to pick ONE variant and that variant will be modeling a plane with a 200 run but REPRESENTING the whole run.

While the NIK2 was greatly improved over the N1K1, it had basically the same engine and same armament, the sorts of things improved were the sorts of things that AH doesn't really model, like landing gear collapse.

I'll grant that it's probably a bit more durable and the flight characteristics a tad different due to the wing position.

And they HAD to pick ONE of the Shidens to model.

I submit the cannon Corsair is much more different in game terms to the regular Corsair than the N1K2 to the NIK1.

[minus]

well it become hard now to survyve, maybe  
TYPHON can help  to kill the Quakebird ?
:-))

[Vermillion]

Now Spinny, why would I begrudge you your -1C ?  Thats not my point in the least, hell... If anything I am looking forward to it myself  

The approx. 1,400 number for the Shinden (yes its a cool name   ) was for all variants including the K1,K2,K3,K4, & K5. But there were only a handful of the K3-K5 variants, less than 30 all together if I remember correctly.  The reason I included the variants together (specifically the K1 and K2) is that for our purposes, their performance is very similar, similar to the 109F4 and 109G2, even though the landing gear and mounting points for the wing were totally different.

Right now, I fly the P-51 myself over the F4U-1 only because it has better visibility and a slightly better acceleration. With the -1C , I will probably become a CannonHog dweeb myself.    Especially if the AAA and strat is ever tuned to make JABO runs effective.

What I find amusing is that the people that complain the most about cannon armed Corsairs, tend to be Luftwaffe 190 types. Its like they think x4 20mm armaments should be reserved for their rides alone.  The amusing part is that if you get very deep into 190 history, is that you find that while x4 20mm were not rare, many many many operational 190's actually had only x2 20mm's, to save on weight and increase performance.

------------------
Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure,
Dicta Verm: "Never give the suckers an even break!" or translated "Never engage without an advantage"

[Westy]

 I personally am tired of people whining about *having* aircraft. Period. Fly the damn planes or or don't. It's a personal choice.
 If it's not here. Lobby for it.
 If it is here? Good. It's one more on the list of aircraft available.
 I'd only really be concerned is if AH folks went suddenly dumb (which they haven't) and added a real imbalancing plane to the match without a counterpart.
 IE: TA-152 but no P47-M or Tempest...
 
 And fwiw (not much) I love the Corsiar they have now. The 4 cannon jobber would be nice for anti buff missions and ground attack.

 --Westy