page out of manual for p38

[rod367th]

the rule that states should run if at disadvantage was taught to all pilots ww2. You could be grounded for disobeying this order.


Offensive Patrol

Flying without escort duties allows the pilots a high degree of flexibility. When the squadron encounters enemy aircraft, the commander must determine the action to be taken. If there are only few enemy aircraft, one flight may be detached. In instances of large numbers of enemy aircraft, the commander may decide to engage, but should run if there are no advantages or at a disadvantage. Individual pilots must use the advantages of the P-38, and it is essential that the pilot not get into instances where the Zero has an advantage. Steep climbs at slow speeds should not be used against the Zero. At altitudes above 20,000 feet, the P-38 has a definite climbing advantage. Circular maneuvers against Zeros must never be used due to the maneuverability of the Zero. However, head-on attacks favor the P-38 due to its concentrated area of firepower and durability of the airframe. The P-38 has the ability to pick its own fight and can avoid combat when at a disadvantage.






 P.S. this is out of Tom Lynch's personal manual. Located at AIRZOO.............

[Redd]

Originally posted by rod367th
the rule that states should run if at disadvantage was taught to all pilots ww2. You could be grounded for disobeying this order.


Offensive Patrol

Flying without escort duties allows the pilots a high degree of flexibility. When the squadron encounters enemy aircraft, the commander must determine the action to be taken. If there are only few enemy aircraft, one flight may be detached. In instances of large numbers of enemy aircraft, the commander may decide to engage, but should run if there are no advantages or at a disadvantage. Individual pilots must use the advantages of the P-38, and it is essential that the pilot not get into instances where the Zero has an advantage. Steep climbs at slow speeds should not be used against the Zero. At altitudes above 20,000 feet, the P-38 has a definite climbing advantage. Circular maneuvers against Zeros must never be used due to the maneuverability of the Zero. However, head-on attacks favor the P-38 due to its concentrated area of firepower and durability of the airframe. The P-38 has the ability to pick its own fight and can avoid combat when at a disadvantage.






 P.S. this is out of Tom Lynch's personal manual. Located at AIRZOO.............

When they were killed thay didn't get to re-up at the nearest base and try again.....

[DREDIOCK]

Originally posted by rod367th
the rule that states should run if at disadvantage was taught to all pilots ww2. You could be grounded for disobeying this order.
 

Yea. In more ways then one lol

[Karnak]

Originally posted by rod367th
the rule that states should run if at disadvantage was taught to all pilots ww2. You could be grounded for disobeying this order.

Don't exagerate this as it is not absolutely true.

You use it as an excuse to say how realisticly you are flying.  However, different situations required different things and many pilots engaged without clear superiority or even at a disadvantage while following orders.

[Soulyss]

BIG difference between what they were doing and what we're doing.

[Raptor]

If your trying to see how realistic you fly, then that page can only be a reference when encountering a zero, Seeing how that is the only plane mentioned. And not too many people fly the zero these days.

[rod367th]

Originally posted by Raptor01
If your trying to see how realistic you fly, then that page can only be a reference when encountering a zero, Seeing how that is the only plane mentioned. And not too many people fly the zero these days.

posted manual from 1945  before Which gave Headon instructions. This is not new. only posted this because it seems 90% get on channel 200 now to let us all know someone is disengageing. I for 1 find that funny and one I think is chicken **** is guy crying that someone is waiting till he has advantage or equal footing.........





Listening to guy crying quit running  $7.47
 Hearing him call others mother names $7.48
Hearing him whine about being Ho   PRICELESS

[Furball]

i would rather follow Albert Ball's example: -

In these combats Capt. Ball, flying alone, on one occasion fought six hostile machines, twice he fought five and once four. When leading two other British aeroplanes he attacked an enemy formation of eight. On each of these occasions he brought down at least one enemy.
   Several times his aeroplane was badly damaged, once so seriously that but for the most delicate handling his machine would have collapsed, as nearly all the control wires had been shot away. On returning with a damaged machine he had always to be restrained from immediately going out on another.
   In all, Capt. Ball has destroyed forty-three German aeroplanes and one balloon, and has always displayed most exceptional courage, determination and skill."

[/i]

[13Promet]

Rod,
the tactics you described are correct for sure, but only as long as you can afford them, i.e. you're overwhelming your opponent both in numbers and equipment, which is the case you're quoting.
When such a situation is not you must fight, that's all. Not for avoiding grounding, rather for avoiding to be martial courted and subsequent rifling for "cowardy in the battlefield".
 And, if you intend your role with honour, loyalty and morality, for not being being responsible for the death of other people.

For example, italian fighters of RSA (northern part, loyal to germans) after sept. '43 have always been fighting with a 1:10 ratio or worse. Which did not prevent them to shoot down more planes than they lost. Planes which were going to ground-level our cities killing thousands of civillians per mission.
If they applied the rules you're quoting, they'd be running all the time. Just for being shot down by the faster american aircrafts dominating our skies and letting the bombers massacre our population.
The same applies to russians in early war, japanese in late war, germans in late war etc.

But AH is a game, therefore neither my statements nor yours are correct in here


Regards


Promet

[FiLtH]

I get a kick out of seeing people taunt a guy who runs. As if the runner is going to say "You better take that back!" and turn around, get in a bad situation and get shot down..just to appease the guy who took a slower plane.

    If you fly a slow plane, that turns well but can't catch anything, dont complain to the faster plane pilot. If you are flying a faster plane and cant stand how everytime you get a spit in your sights, he breaks off, ruining your shot, dont complain to the spit pilot.

    The beauty of this game, is that occasionally, you meet a pilot flying the same plane, in the same advantage. When you win that fight, you feel great...and when you lose, you know you just better keep quiet....with a thrown in to your opponent.

[rod367th]

There is no shame on 1 who disengages, That is only point of text. Is it the way I fly no. And good example is yesturdays fight of me and 2 brits taking on Nit niki, spit, 262,190 & 205 even after 190 ho'ed me got oil I stayed in fight to help countrymen. then at last minute I went back to base landed as engine siezed with 262 spit 190 pelts. Now when money was on the line in ace'sHigh it was dif. Flew the way most were trained to fly in real life, GET advantage, Use sun and disengage when at disadvantaged or out numbered.



  As for me I have more respect for those who disengage then those who just turn come back Ho Ho Ho till one or both of you dead. Some Like to play like its real life to see how they do and that is great.  To whine on how others play game is one of the most absurd things in AH. I don't even care about those who use shade accounts to pad scores (I just fel sorry for them, Because they don't know that most can tell by scores who's padding what)


 Fly how you want. Let others fly there way. No need to call him or her names on 200.





 My Favorite thing to do is to make fun of those whinning on 200 about how others are flying.


 HEY P#@$Y turn and fight= === My plane turns better
 ACK HUGGER                    ======== Let me vulch you
  la 7 @#$dweeb              ====== damn i forgot to use la7
   ( check next time guy whines on 200 about la7 you see he flys it lol )

 @#~!  brings a plane to a tank fight==== play my way%&^*#%
Run to your friends   =========== Quit playing smart i have no friends

This can go on and on lol



Now the lynch post was becasue a Player who Ho's alot called a newbie name after name fo ho'ing him back. Told him to go play quake, /when told Ho was used in war so why not here. He then turned his attention to me ( which is what I wanted of course) I went on to explain that Chuck Yeager used HO so did bong and many others. Its everyones right to play there way.

[Eagler]

Just read "First Light" about a RAF pilot in BOB

seems besides flying to the fight there wasn't a whole bunch of winging going on either ... once the fighting started it was everyman for himself with SOP being once you lost alt, you hauled arse back to base or the English coast depending on fight location...

then again their furballs lasted a few minutes, sometimes seconds ...

[mechanic]

Originally posted by Eagler
Just read "First Light" about a RAF pilot in BOB

seems besides flying to the fight there wasn't a whole bunch of winging going on either ... once the fighting started it was everyman for himself with SOP being once you lost alt, you hauled arse back to base or the English coast depending on fight location...

then again their furballs lasted a few minutes, sometimes seconds ...

great book!   about 92 squadron if im not mistaken.

excelent read, would advise anyon who enjoys novels/combat aviation to read it

[TequilaChaser]

Originally posted by rod367th

Now the lynch post was becasue a Player who Ho's alot called a newbie name after name fo ho'ing him back. Told him to go play quake, /when told Ho was used in war so why not here. He then turned his attention to me ( which is what I wanted of course) I went on to explain that Chuck Yeager used HO so did bong and many others. Its everyones right to play there way.

Well, just maybe....since Bong, Yeager and others relied on HO quite often , maybe just maybe their flying skills are not all cracked up to what others think they are/were.  Or just maybe they were feeling lazy and wanted a lazy quick way out of the fight..........they did not feel lik eimposing their superior flying / maneuvering skills on the lesser foe........

Everybody in AH Head Ons at one time or another......the only ones that I ever see being taunted are the HO shooters that continously rev just to HO, not the ones that are actually working on angles and what may look like a HO to you was a deflection shot to them......

and anyhow this is just a Comabt flight Sim game, and anything goes......just like War anything goes..their are no rules and nothing ...concerning a dogfight is fair........

Dueling someone with same plane, same fuel, same ammo loadout , same alt, is the only fair fight you can incounter in AH