Author Topic: Will The KI-84 be modeled with 100 octane fuel? (Read 594 times)

F4UDOA · « **on:** September 15, 2004, 03:36:10 PM »

Or will it be modeled with the tree sap the Japanese Army Air force was using for fuel at the time?

GRUNHERZ · « **Reply #1 on:** September 15, 2004, 03:47:58 PM »

It will have 150 grade british fuel and MW50...

Karnak · « **Reply #2 on:** September 15, 2004, 03:48:39 PM »

According to an earlier thread it wouldn't make much difference.

The difference in the performance between the two existing Japanese tests and the one American test is mostly due to the fact that the Japanese tests were on the first and second prototypes respectively. Japanese engineers claimed that the production Ki-84 did ~415mph due to it's more powerful engine, cleaner lines and exhaust thrust generating stubs.

The real question is "Will HTC use the prototype test data or try to do a production version on minimal data?"

Personally I'm guessing it will use the test data for the second prototype and top out at 392mph.

We'll see.

GRUNHERZ is correct that it should have MW50.

Wotan · « **Reply #3 on:** September 15, 2004, 03:59:09 PM »

From what I have read 100 octane was used to simulate water/methanol.

Like German planes the ki-84 used water/methanol injection to run at higher boost. Water was injected into the eye of the SC and evaporated cooling the charge. This increased the temp / pressure at which the lower octane would detonate.

Higher octane fuel detonates at a higher temp / pressure and should allow for a higher boost. But high Octane fuel run in an eng with a low compression ratio would not burn as clean and you would end up with a dirty intake and not much of a performance boost. Eng wear would be a problem as well because of the higher temp.

If the Ki-84 is without water/methanol then MAP limits for 87 octane will indeed mean a much slower plane then one with 100 octane or one with 87 + water / methanol. It wouldn't make sense that the US would have tested the Ki-84 with higher MAP settings then were used by the Japanese with 87 + water.

However I have not seen any records from the US flight tests that shows the MAP settings.

I am not saying the Ki-84 in AH should do 420. I could careless.

One thing we should note though is Japanese avgas was being produced from all sorts of things and in that sense even its 87 octane fuel was probably not that good later in the war.

I only point this out because I don't want people to just point to 100 octane fuel as some sort of majic juice.

Guppy35 · « **Reply #4 on:** September 15, 2004, 04:17:34 PM »

I'm not implying you guys are doing this, but the thread had me worried for just a sec as I wondered if it was going to be the first ever argument about performance of an AH aircraft BEFORE anyone had flown it in the game

Dan/Slack

GRUNHERZ · « **Reply #5 on:** September 15, 2004, 04:24:06 PM »

I think people will be dissapoinred with Ki84 performance. It wont be as fast as they want and wont turn as well as they think, we know it doesnt climb all that great and the ammo wont last long. Spit V should eat it for lunch...

Karnak · « **Reply #6 on:** September 15, 2004, 04:27:36 PM »

GRUNHERZ,

Even on the lowest end Ki-84 data the Spit V will be way too slow to "eat it for lunch."

If the Ki-84 pilot tries to trunfight the Spit V you would be correct, but if the Ki-84 flies to it's strengths the Spit V would be in trouble.

mora · « **Reply #7 on:** September 15, 2004, 04:28:45 PM »

Yep, some people allready cry for it to be perked. Does it do anything better than niki?

GRUNHERZ · « **Reply #8 on:** September 15, 2004, 04:37:28 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Karnak
GRUNHERZ,

Even on the lowest end Ki-84 data the Spit V will be way too slow to "eat it for lunch."

If the Ki-84 pilot tries to trunfight the Spit V you would be correct, but if the Ki-84 flies to it's strengths the Spit V would be in trouble.

Karnak we are talking MA pilots..

GRUNHERZ · « **Reply #9 on:** September 15, 2004, 04:38:10 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by mora
Yep, some people allready cry for it to be perked. Does it do anything better than niki?

Its maybe 20mph faster...

Karnak · « **Reply #10 on:** September 15, 2004, 04:47:29 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by mora
Yep, some people allready cry for it to be perked. Does it do anything better than niki?

It is much faster.

GRUNHERZ,

They're not all that bad. Sure, many will die in dumb ways, but not all.

I do agree that it will not be the best fighter in AH though. The La-7 would be better still for sure.

Wotan · « **Reply #11 on:** September 15, 2004, 06:53:15 PM »

If HT goes the safe route with 390-395 max speed, which I expect he will, then the Ki-84 isn’t going to be the plane most seem to think it will be.

It will still be a fine ac and a fun plane to fly but in competition with the niki, spits and la7s for usage I doubt it will ever rise to a point where it would need to be perked.

If the Ki-84 does over 400 max speed then it starts to become uber and the Ami whining will be quickly follow:

"Jap fuel was made of pine nuts and sea shells. There's no way in hell a ki-84 could ever break 400mph"

Glasses · « **Reply #12 on:** September 17, 2004, 09:07:07 PM »

That's "Ameriwhiners" (TM) (R)

Wotan · « **Reply #13 on:** September 17, 2004, 09:16:26 PM »

Farm bois, Allied Opportunists, Amiwhiners take your pick...