better guns on JU88's?

[hazed-]

If i remember correctly HTC decided to bow to B26/b17 pilots who were complaining that they were underpowered in the gun department and upped the lethality of the guns...
Im not sure what they did but lots of people found it was suddenly impossible to kill them.well things seem tohave settled down and they seem to be set at a good level for B17s/b26's now ...maybe their guns a little too good but i like the way they are now because it means you have to plan your attack! everyone is happy  
Well since 1.04 Ive been flying the JU88 and i think its a fantastic plane BUT were the guns on ju88 really that weak? I have hit attacking planes many times and hardly scratched them and its got to the stage now where i know ive got very little chance compared to a gunner on the other bombers.the problem is i want to fly LW.I realise the guns are different and LW were not as powerful but in the interest of play balance, much like b26/b17 pilots had, I am requesting the ju88 guns be made just a little stronger.
anyone else agree?..please remember i love the ju88 as much as you Americans love your b26's etc and im sure Lanc pilots would appreciate something similar.( also the specs for ju88a4 in concise guide to axis aircraft state they had 1 forward firing mg81 plus one forward firing 13mm MG 131 in front and ah doesnt   )
If the guns cant be changed maybe JU88 should be a little more robust and take slightly more damage.As it is now an attacker can fly 600 off my six and ignore my shots (almost) and perform what is really a poor attack and get a kill.
shouldnt it be the same as for other bombers and require a good/well executed attack?
I have to stress i dont mind being shot down in ju88 but not when ive put 150 rounds into my attacker   please reward me a little more for hitting an opponent with my guns  

Thnx hazed
fire away people!

[Fishu]

Ju-88 A-4 actually has 7.92mm ventral gun replaced with 13mm
Though, there is A-4 versions with 20mm cannon fitted in the nose, was it below the bombadier  

[Hristo]

Scenario

[juzz]

"If i remember correctly HTC decided to bow to B26/b17 pilots who were complaining that they were underpowered in the gun department and upped the lethality of the guns..."

Nope, never happened.

[tshred]

Yes they did Juzz, the .50 cal's on the B26/B17 have increased range. I has been posted.

ts

[Vermillion]

tshred, its not the guns of the B17/B26

Every gunner in the game is the same in that respect.

B17,B256, Lanc, Ju88, M16, Ostie, Panzer, they all are like that.

------------------
Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure

[Kieren]

To directly address one point of your argument-

Yes, the 7.62mm would be that weak compared to the .50's. Further, the B-17 can point six of them at you if you make a sloppy approach, whereas the Ju88 might get two of its guns on you at once. No contest, the B-17 wins hands-down.

We all know that the Ju88 was designed as a "schnell bomber", where speed would be its primary defense. I am all for adding more armament to it in the form of later marks (which of course was planned from the start), but I would want a coresponding increase in the weight, along with a deterioration of its performance.

[funked]

Find me a photo of a Ju 88A-4 with flex-mount MG 131 in the nose or in the aft ventral mount.  I think it's another William Green fantasy...  

[Fishu]

 

Originally posted by funked:
Find me a photo of a Ju 88A-4 with flex-mount MG 131 in the nose or in the aft ventral mount.  I think it's another William Green fantasy...  

That ventral 13mm gun is in many sources that I've read of.
Late production A-4 had this factory installed, while early production consisted of 7.92mm package. (and we know A-4 was in production for fairly long time)

[funked]

How many of those sources copied straight out of Green's book, just like the MG 151 in Me 109 cowling?

[Fishu]

 

Originally posted by funked:
How many of those sources copied straight out of Green's book, just like the MG 151 in Me 109 cowling?

Excuse me, but why are you talking about him when it is me talking?
I don't know anything about ME109 having MG151 in the cowling..
I might have heard of 15mm 'cannon' being installed into the cowling, but that was more likely into Fw190D.
We're not talking of fighters here, it is about Ju-88 and I am certain that those had 13mm in the back of the cockpit in later produced versions (and field conversion kits)
I don't know anything about greens book so why don't you, with all the respect, shut up?

[hazed-]

ok guys i wasnt trying to stir up debate on the validity of our sources of info ...    
mainly i wanted to address the fact that when i gun a b17 in ah its easy to kill if you hit..pretty similar in b26...then theres the ju88 which even when i hit attacker  LOADS of times i rarely cause much damage or if i do i normally use 2/3rds of my ammo    
all i want is a bit more reward for good gunning against poor attacks.
I am a paying customer like everyone else and i choose/prefer LW planes mostly so please dont make it a real pain to survive in them,after all i pay £20 a month to have fun in here    
p.s. kieren just a little more power in guns ..not much ...just if i hit with 100+rounds i feel i deserve some reward    
 
hazed (thanks for input guys)

btw are we sure increased range applies to all vehicles/planes mentioned by vermillion?



[This message has been edited by hazed- (edited 10-17-2000).]

[GRUNHERZ]

HI

The sad thing is the Ju88 is prolly the only bomber in the sim previously called AH, whose firepower is accurately portrayed. The "50cals" on allied bombers seem to be  something in the 20mm range in hit performamnce. And the old excuse that buff guns were so strong cuz 6 or 8 "50cals" hit you at once, doesnt hold up anymore. Just give the lancaster rear turret with 2 supposed "50cals" a second or two and ull see. It just plain sucks.  

[hazed-]

cc grunhertz
people seem to forget 0.50-in is just 12.7mm MG
LW MG131 is a 13mm MG
Id love to see data showing the difference in these 2 MG's.
also LW 30mm had exploding shells i beleive and i have read that 1 round could totally destroy an aircraft.Anyone ever read same description about hispano's? and why? because they were not as remarkable as that deadly 30mm round.
<gulp> here comes the flame  

Hazed

[Fishu]

Talking of Lancaster versus Ju-88 A-4, it is interesting that Lancaster has 2x.50 cal tail turret version instead of more regular 4x.303 turret.
..while Ju-88 A-4 has all 7.92mm, with no possibility for 13mm