Evil P-51 tricks & tips

[terracota]

Any expert p-51 driver there can share at least 1 of his evil tricks and tips with me ?
 
please not the very now tips like :never flat turn, etc. bla,bla.
some hidden trick you discovered maybe a maneuver or something like that?
AMMO somebody said to me that you are one of the finest p-51 drivers  , you have some evil tip to mee
ok thank's to all

if you dont want to share your tip I will buy it to you   just tell me how much it cost, of course I will pay you with virtual money like  t$3.00 (thank'$) or thank's thank's and thank's  

[Yeager]

Heres a trick fer ya:

Leave it in the hanger.  P51 is anemic in AH and has a stubborn habbit of shedding wings far more commonly than any other type.

Yeager

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[This message has been edited by Yeager (edited 07-19-2000).]

[-ammo-]

Wow, someone lied to you

Well, if there was some advice I would give it would be this--

1) never take off when there are enemy around, always from a field away from the action. Get used to the long climbouts. Climb to at least 26K. The 51 is at its best at that altitude.

2) Be picky about your battles, dont dive into huge furballs, take the ones on the outskirts. If you must dive into the furball, get out as quickly as you came in.

3) Stay fast! I dont "saddle up" on cons when in the pony. I make good passes at them then cash my speed back into altitude. Always strive to be higher than your enemy.

4) when in trouble dont be embarrased about running, just do it. the pony's speed is its biggest advantage so use it. extend to a safe distance then reengage the con.

there are several REAL good pony pilots, maybe they will chime in with there thoughts.

If you wouldlike, I would be happy to get with youi in the TA and show some manuevers.
Email me and we can set it up.

ammo

[Yeager]

Thats my point ammo    

All good conservative tips BTW just ashame to see the premier allied fighter of WW2 relegated to feeding on the leftovers and otherwise using its *only* admirable quality in AH, speed.

Yeager

I used to fly the P51D in AH exclusively.  All beta tours up to tour 4.  Especially troubling is the total lack of even half assed performance above 23k.  Did I mention the ease with which the pony jettisons its wings?  *IMO* Its totally whacked out from the  historical record.  
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[This message has been edited by Yeager (edited 07-19-2000).]

[av8or]

obviously as you can see some people don't care for the 51.However it is one of the airplanes that i fly.Some rules that i live by never let the speed bleed below 200 and when i zoom in on a enemy i will drop 10 flap for a little more control don't forget to retract them when zooming back up.If i am one v one and i saddle up then i go 20 flap and the plane will turn better but keep an eye out for cons because when you saddle up you are open to other enemies.Always pick your fights and fight them on your terms.

[Soulyss]

The pony is definetly an plane meant to be on the offensive.  It is great when you have the fight on your terms and is severly handi-capped when forced into situations of being at an E disadvantage.  The best tactic is to fight on your terms only.  The 51 is really good if in a somewhat restricted way.  At high speeds especially in dives I will pull out using only my trim tabs, seems to help keep the wings on.      I've been told you can turn with some oponents if you're plane is light enough and you can keep your speed up, but only for a couple passes after that it's time to roll out and bugger off, come back later you have the gas for it.    

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"Smoke me a kipper boys, I'll be back for breakfast"

[This message has been edited by Soulyss (edited 07-19-2000).]

[humble]

Sadly, there are no "evil pony" tricks (least that I've found). Ammo's real message is pretty simple...take the high ground...or run.

Now going beyond that is truely an iffy thing...but here are a couple of things to try. The pony is a good turning plane...when FAST. Now if you are engaged with a plane that has a slower top end by a nice margin(spit,nikki,zero), you can use that to your advantage. On merge extend thru..horizontally and watch bogie closely...if he goes for seperation and lead turn...start a gentle turn AWAY from his turn..unless he purely vertical you'll see which way to go. Keep your G's LOW...2.5 max and your speed up...never get below 300 if you can help it. Now if the con is pulling hard to gain angles at high speed he's really bleeding E...if he's "lagging" you (not gaining angles) level wings and run. Now if he's gaining hard he should be burning E...go into a quick dive and low G zoom...if you do it right you'll top con out 1.2 to 1.5 under you. It wont work with G10 or 38 and is iffy against other planes with high potential E like the 205...but is a sweet trick to use on over aggressive spits nikki's etc.

[This message has been edited by humble (edited 07-19-2000).]

[Duckwing6]

Also the P51 has awesome hanlding with the combat flaps deployed -> *warning* Useage of flaps in a dogfight is pretty much a lst ditch effort when there are other cons around because then you're too slow already.

This is true for all US planes in AH:

P51, P47, P38 and F4U

I use 1st Flap setting when coming over the top of a loop or immelmann and in nose low scissors -> don't forget to retract them when you don't need them tho as they'll decrease your acceleration significantly!

[terracota]

uff thank's good trick's  
and ammo sure I will drop ya a nota to see if we can meet this weekend, american time  

just 1 quiestion:
you guys said never drop spped under 250-300 this is true in a zoom too?
if I start the immelman before 300 I will be fast but not higher than the enemy  
so what's the trick? or only in zoom I shpuld drop speed under that to gain more alt?

thank's to all for the replies

[Duckwing6]

That's what a Zoom climb is for terracotta  

[-ammo-]

Yeager, you are one good P-51 pilot Does Hangtime know how you feel about the pony?

well, I dont know what it did in real life so I cant say whether it is hobbled in AH or WB's ar whatever game. It is true, the advice I gave you terra is basic smart flying and conservative. It is the kind of advice that will keep you alive and a few kills to boot. It can also be applied to to most high wing loaded AC in AH (and even the good turners, except for the speed comment).
The P-51 does well in its envelope, But in a multi-AC battle, there are better choices in my opinion. Just remember thas soon as you dive and engage chances are a high con will show up, never fails AC to watch for when in the Pony--the spit 9, N1K1, FW190A5, and the YAK all get my fullest attention when I'm in the Pony, but only if they are coalt or higher.

Like any other AC, it takes practice and experience. Be patient in your flying style. There is a time to be aggresive and a time to be passive, experience will tell you when. Oh--BTW when you are zooming, you are gonna get slow, thats just gravity, but you are conserving energy by doing this. Just dont do it with a con at your 6 Got your Email--will cya tonite.

ammo

[terracota]

 

Originally posted by Duckwing6:
That's what a Zoom climb is for terracotta    

Yes I now ,but what Im asking is if u zoom climb at near stall speed or when I get 200 300 speed I start the reverse?   (immelman, etc).
what I do now is if I'm at 400 start the zoom them when reached the stall speed or near I start the reverse, of course I'm talking about a merge  
oh! Duckwing I'm learnig just with films that redwing send to me   I got the duel that you guys did the other day, this is one of my best films, very descriptive and I'm learning a lot of merge things with this kind of films  (just stay away from flack's in duels   )

CC ammo see ya tonit  


[This message has been edited by terracota (edited 07-20-2000).]

[StSanta]

Heh stay hi, run away, pick on the outer vulnerable fighters.

Hristo call such people "opportunists"  

<G, D, R>

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StSanta
JG54 "Grünherz"

[humble]

terracota,

your really using a zoom as an E fighting tactic...so speed isn't the issue it's seperation. In the example I gave you above your using the efficiency of the wing at high speed to force a better turning plane to bleed E thru higher drag. As he gains angles he'll lose E..now if you judge it right he'll be neg E to you before he kills you...you good go level and run away in other words. Now, if you start to climb a couple things can happen...since the spit and nikki both outclimb the pony a gentle climb works against you in long run...if you pull to many G's to quick you may bleed E to fast and top out early. Find the sweet spot and you'll convert E to alt quick enough that the spit cant rebuild it's E enough for a shot...ideally you'll sucker em into a nose up situation where they're hanging prop 800 below you...you'll be 120 or so 1/2 flaps in an almost flat turn around em at end. reason for the turn is it eliminates the prop shot...no rudder authority at top of stall so they cant follow you around with nose. So here the key is closure, if the con starts to close to quickly in the zoom you goofed...Idealy the closure will be slow and controlled...you know you got em when you need to cutwep and/or throttle to keep em hooked.

[Duckwing6]

terracotta as humble said the speed you have when you start your reversal after a zoom climb is depending on

A) how agressive you want to reverse/re-attack


b) How much speration you seek


For example in the F4U i will usually go for a large lateral (alt) seperation between me and a more nimble opponent because when i come down i can negate any turn he does whil just rolling in the vertical.
Against a slower turning opponent or a bogie that is really low on Speed/E i'll probably start reversal earlier (higher speed, more agressive).

Also the threat sitation plays into this .. if it's 1 enemy only and you're alone in the sector you can be a lot more agressive than when he has some buddies hanging around.

DW6

p.s. yea the Duells against Rediwing were great   (the ack wasn't shooting btw .. there's something messy with the film viewer when your arena has the field set to a diffrent country