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Author Topic: Coulter-ese  (Read 1860 times)

Offline Karnak

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« Reply #15 on: November 04, 2004, 02:47:13 PM »
Mini D,

Yes, but when you refine those questions it becomes less lopsided.  When you phrase the question of partial birth abortion this way "Do you support a ban on Partial Birth Abortion without any protections for the health of the mother?" that 80% drops way, way down.  Similarly if you phrase the gay marriage question as "Do you support a ban on Gay Marriage and on Civil Unions that give similar rights?" the perentages drop way down.

That is the difference between the Republican and Democratic positions.  Not huge, but present.

The Dems didn't alient their voters, the Repubs were more effective in distorting the other side's position.
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Offline GtoRA2

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« Reply #16 on: November 04, 2004, 02:48:06 PM »
Karnak
 were did you see a brake down of what was important to the voters?


I would like to have a look.

Thanks
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Offline 1K0N

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« Reply #17 on: November 04, 2004, 02:49:41 PM »
Dems dont want to listen to why they lost which is good, dont bother to point it out...Better for us to keep winning the elections...

IKON
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Offline Karnak

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« Reply #18 on: November 04, 2004, 02:57:01 PM »
GtorA2,

Here: http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/states/US/P/00/epolls.0.html

And blatantly stealing a post from another board:

Most Important Quality of your candidate:
    Bush Voters: Religious Faith (91%) and honesty/trustworthiness (70%)

    Kerry Voters: Will Bring about change (95%) and intelligence (91%)

Church Attendance:
    Bush Voters: 63% of Bush Voters attend church more than once a week, 58% attended church at least once a wekk

    Kerry Voters: In comparison, only 35% and 41% of Kerry voters go to church more than once a week or weekly

Most Important Issue:
    Bush Voters: Terrorism (86%) and Moral values werethe most important issues for Bush Voters (79%). Only two other issues (Health Care and Economy/Jobs) were less important than Iraq

    Kerry Voters: Iraq, Education, Economy/Jobs, and Health Care were all the most important (between 75 and 80%), terrorism was a distant concern at 14%

Is Iraq Part of War on Terrorism?
    Bush Voters: Yes, by 80%

    Kerry Voters: No, by 88%

Bush Mostly Listens to:
    Bush Voters: Ordinary Americans (93%)

    Kerry Voters: Large Corporations (82%)

Type of Community
    Bush Voters: 58% of voters in Rural America voted for Bush, making up his largest contigent, followed by small towns (50%) and suburbs (51%)

    Kerry Voters: In contrast, 62% of big cities voted for Kerry


1K0N,

We're listening and thinking about it.

One point that I have long maintained is that we (Dems) should get away from Gun Control.
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    Offline Mini D

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    « Reply #19 on: November 04, 2004, 02:57:06 PM »
    Karnak, you're trying to get way to specific... and think you're actually making sense when you do it.  You're not.

    You seem to think that if the question had been phrased differently, people would have responded more pro.  In truth, the word "abortion" is at the root of the problem... not the specifics of partial birth abortion.  This is something democratic leaders simply are not grasping.  Thanks for demonstrating why.
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    Offline Karnak

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    « Reply #20 on: November 04, 2004, 03:00:26 PM »
    Mini D,

    Evidence?

    Last poll I saw said 55% of Americans support a right to choose in the first trimester.  Further the polls I've seen that make the distinctions I mentioned do show markedly different results from the simple black and white choices you listed.

    Note that Bush did not win 80% of the vote, he won 51% of the vote.
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    Offline GtoRA2

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    « Reply #21 on: November 04, 2004, 03:15:50 PM »
    Karnak,
     Nice post thanks.


     The first thing that ran through my mind on this was

    Quote
    terrorism was a distant concern at 14%


    I gues they have forgoten?
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    Offline AKS\/\/ulfe

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    « Reply #22 on: November 04, 2004, 03:17:28 PM »
    Quote
    Originally posted by GtoRA2
    I gues they have forgoten?


    Please God, do not let this statemet inspire another nevar forgit post/thread.
    -SW
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    Offline GtoRA2

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    « Reply #23 on: November 04, 2004, 03:34:07 PM »
    Wulfie
     You do not find it interesting how low this was?

     I said it was a first thing that came to mind not right.
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    Offline Karnak

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    « Reply #24 on: November 04, 2004, 04:35:18 PM »
    GtoRA2,

    Don't read to specific a meaning into these things.  There are a lot of possible reasons.

    For example in my case I don't, and never have, felt a personal threat from terrorism.  I have talked to people who were near frantic with worry about a terrorist attack at some essentially nameless location like Novato, CA.  I believe that Bush and Kerry would both go after the terrorists as they should, though I think Kerry would have been slightly more effective.  Given the relatively even status I held the two candidates in regards to terrorism and my lack of personal fear about it, it was not that high a concern for me.

    So you see in my case it wasn't an issue really because I trusted Bush and Kerry to both take care of it.  I think Bush will get Osama bin Laden.
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    Offline straffo

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    « Reply #25 on: November 04, 2004, 04:48:54 PM »
    Quote
    Originally posted by Karnak
    Note that Bush did not win 80% of the vote, he won 51% of the vote.


    Plus with a 60% participation it's pretty difficult to have the said "80% of the American"...

    Or I can't do maths again :)
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    Offline GtoRA2

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    « Reply #26 on: November 04, 2004, 04:52:04 PM »
    Karnak,

    I am not reading much into, it was just a flash though, you know like the have you forgoten song jumped into my head.


    Honestly on a personal level I am not worried about terrorism at all, and it has not effected my life at all. I do realise it is a threat though and needs to be activly countered.



    unfortunatly, neither Bush or Kerry is willing to do what really needs to be done to secure this nation, and that is close the borders for real.
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    Offline Karnak

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    « Reply #27 on: November 04, 2004, 05:04:23 PM »
    Well, I can't speak for anybody else, but rest assured this Liberal hasn't forgotten.

    Quote
    Originally posted by GtoRA2
    unfortunatly, neither Bush or Kerry is willing to do what really needs to be done to secure this nation, and that is close the borders for real.

    That's true.
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    Offline rshubert

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    « Reply #28 on: November 04, 2004, 05:13:31 PM »
    Quote
    Originally posted by GtoRA2

    unfortunatly, neither Bush or Kerry is willing to do what really needs to be done to secure this nation, and that is close the borders for real.


    Respectfully, that is exactly the wrong approach.  Nobody ever won a conflict of any kind by being on the defensive.  You gotta go after them, find them, destroy them, and make sure they can't come after you.  Defensive measures are important, yes...but they can't keep you safe forever.  No defensive system can work all the time, every time, perfectly.

    That is why I support Bush.  He is doing exactly that--going on the offensive against our enemies.  Are all his decisions correct?  I don't know, and nobody can know for years.  But he is doing the right thing, i think, i hope, and i pray.



    shubie
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    Offline Karnak

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    « Reply #29 on: November 04, 2004, 05:19:59 PM »
    rshubert,

    America is strong enough to do both at the same time.  Nobody suggested playing turtle.  That we must go after the terrorists and kill them is clear.
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