Author Topic: Armor vs. Aircraft  (Read 748 times)

Offline MadSquirrel

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« on: November 27, 2004, 01:25:55 AM »
About 6 to 8 months ago, I read a thread that talked about how aircraft killing tanks had been way wrong.  I would really like to see that thread again and can't find it.  If it was a quote then I would like to find where it was from.  I have searched and been unable to find it.  I hope one of you can help me.

I discussed how straffing might have blown the external fuel tanks on some German tanks, but done little more.  It went on to talk about how bomb blasts might have flipped the tank and might have killed the crew.  It talked about how pilots might have seen the fireball of an exploding fuel cell and thought it was a dead tank and reported it as such, but in fact very few tanks were killed by straffing or bombing aircraft.  Way fewer than had been reported.

Thanks in advance.

LTARsqrl  

Offline JB73

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #1 on: November 27, 2004, 03:11:02 AM »
I don't know what to put here yet.

Offline MadSquirrel

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #2 on: November 27, 2004, 03:33:40 AM »
As stated in my original text, I have done a search for this and been unable to find it.

Offline DREDIOCK

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Re: Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #3 on: November 27, 2004, 09:25:18 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by MadSquirrel
About 6 to 8 months ago, I read a thread that talked about how aircraft killing tanks had been way wrong.  I would really like to see that thread again and can't find it.  If it was a quote then I would like to find where it was from.  I have searched and been unable to find it.  I hope one of you can help me.

I discussed how straffing might have blown the external fuel tanks on some German tanks, but done little more.  It went on to talk about how bomb blasts might have flipped the tank and might have killed the crew.  It talked about how pilots might have seen the fireball of an exploding fuel cell and thought it was a dead tank and reported it as such, but in fact very few tanks were killed by straffing or bombing aircraft.  Way fewer than had been reported.

Thanks in advance.

LTARsqrl  


I remember that thread. it was in the Gamplay feedback forum.

I think the general concensus was not so much the bombing but the straffing.
I know I've said several times that the majority of Tanks that were killed by aircraft were due to them being bombed. Not strafed.
And that while they may have taken some damage due to staffing, Straffing alone more often then not didnt "kill" them.

How its modeled now seems to be pretty right on. IMO
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Offline DREDIOCK

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2004, 09:35:46 AM »
BTW I think this is the thread you were looking for

]when is the Gv damage model getting fixed
« Last Edit: November 27, 2004, 09:38:08 AM by DREDIOCK »
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Offline bj229r

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #5 on: November 27, 2004, 09:56:54 AM »
Saw a Discovery Wings thin about IL2, they kilt MANY tanks by strafin in packs (of course they didnt do it with .50's like in here)
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers

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Offline MadSquirrel

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2004, 06:35:54 PM »
The thread that I read came out way before AH2 was released.

I have used the search engine to look for the article with no luck.  

I don't remember exactly what the main topic was about, but the article was very specific as to the fact that Bombing and Straffing of tanks was commonly reported as kills, when in fact most were not kills.  With all the GV folks out there, I figured someone would have remembered this article as it was very good.

I am still hoping someone remembers it and can direct me to it.

Thanks again.

LTARsqrl  

Offline hyena426

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2004, 06:41:46 PM »
i remmeber reading a book were it talked about straifing tanks,,and it was saying that p47 pilots didnt have the gun power to kill a tank,,so what they would do is shoot infront of the tank,,and the mount of lead and bullets going under the tank would raize the dirt so fast,,it would flip the tank over,,im not sure how true this story is,,but thats what i read once,,lol

Offline Kweassa

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2004, 08:47:27 PM »
In order to flip a tank by digging dirt you'd need to grind off truckloads of them near a tank.

 That's like trying to dig a swimming pool in your back yard with shotguns. I seriously doubt a single P-47 would ever have so much ammo, or opportunity, to strafe a tnak in that manner.

Offline GRUNHERZ

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #9 on: November 29, 2004, 08:53:38 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by hyena426
i remmeber reading a book were it talked about straifing tanks,,and it was saying that p47 pilots didnt have the gun power to kill a tank,,so what they would do is shoot infront of the tank,,and the mount of lead and bullets going under the tank would raize the dirt so fast,,it would flip the tank over,,im not sure how true this story is,,but thats what i read once,,lol


A new twist on the shooting at the road to kill the tank fantasy!


:D

Offline Masherbrum

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #10 on: November 29, 2004, 11:42:01 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by hyena426
i remmeber reading a book were it talked about straifing tanks,,and it was saying that p47 pilots didnt have the gun power to kill a tank,,so what they would do is shoot infront of the tank,,and the mount of lead and bullets going under the tank would raize the dirt so fast,,it would flip the tank over,,im not sure how true this story is,,but thats what i read once,,lol


Were you sober when reading this?  This might be the most insane post I have ever seen.

Karaya
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Offline vorticon

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #11 on: November 29, 2004, 11:48:07 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Masherbrum
Were you sober when reading this?  This might be the most insane post I have ever seen.

Karaya


dont read the o'club much, do you?

Offline hyena426

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #12 on: November 30, 2004, 12:02:59 AM »
Besides their bomb and rocket payloads, the P-47 and the Typhoon both boasted powerful gun armaments. The Typhoon had four 20mm Hispano cannon. The P-47 carried eight .50 cal. machine guns with 400 rounds per gun, and it proved "particularly successful" against transports. The machine guns occasionally even caused casualties to tanks and tank crews. The .50 cal. armor-piercing bullets often penetrated the underside of vehicles after ricocheting off the road, or penetrated the exhaust system of the tanks, ricocheting around the interior of the armored hull, killing or wounding the crew and sometimes igniting the fuel supply or detonating ammunition storage. This seemed surprising at first, given the typically heavy armor of German tanks. Yet Maj. Gen. J. Lawton "Lightning Joe" Collins, Commander of First Army's VII Corps, was impressed enough to mention to Quesada the success that P-47s had strafing tanks with .50 cal. machine gun fire.


thats about all i can find about it at the moment about tanks being killed to by 50cal gun fire,,like i said about the mound of dirt thing,i have no idea if it was true or not,,but i read about it,,lol

Offline Masherbrum

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #13 on: November 30, 2004, 12:31:18 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by vorticon
dont read the o'club much, do you?


Did a Search for entire BBS, and NADA.

My statement still stands.

Karaya
« Last Edit: November 30, 2004, 12:33:59 AM by Masherbrum »
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Offline vorticon

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Armor vs. Aircraft
« Reply #14 on: November 30, 2004, 12:43:34 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Masherbrum
Did a Search for entire BBS, and NADA.

My statement still stands.

Karaya


it pains me to have to do this, as it is myself i am ridiculing...

http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=50012&highlight=american+planes+over+europe

3rd post down...


I WIN