Author Topic: German Language article on BMW801D boost systems (Read 2753 times)

MiloMorai · « **Reply #45 on:** December 17, 2004, 04:11:16 PM »

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Originally posted by Crumpp
How many times do I have to explain it, Milo. They don't get in the way.

What are the chances they experimented before arriving at the 1943 formula, Milo. What are the chances this experimentation left them with usable but inferior fuel.

Crumpp

Why don't they get in the way when the distance between the spheres is less than the dia. of the tank? Next you will be telling me a square peg with the same dia. as a hole will fit in that round hole with ease.

They produced experimental fuel to be used in combat a/c in the quantities that would have left excess stock of the 'inferior' fuel. What ever you say Crumpp.

Crumpp · « **Reply #46 on:** December 17, 2004, 04:41:36 PM »

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Why don't they get in the way when the distance between the spheres is less than the dia. of the tank? Next you will be telling me a square peg with the same dia. as a hole will fit in that round hole with ease.

Nice drawing. In real aircraft it comes out nicely.

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They produced experimental fuel to be used in combat a/c in the quantities that would have left excess stock of the 'inferior' fuel. What ever you say Crumpp.

Again Milo. Please get an education on fuel production. Petroleum companies produce inferior fuel everyday within the same grade. Why do you think Amoco has the guarentee stuck on the side of their pumps? Check it out the next time your mom fills up the tank.

Crumpp

MiloMorai · « **Reply #47 on:** December 17, 2004, 05:20:42 PM »

You have yet to explain the extraction procedure once all the connections have been all undone. Getting info from you is like pulling teeth from a chicken. But then if you don't know, would explain all.

When you get an English language comprehension education Crumpp.

You did say EXPERIMENTAL.

Experimental(test) fuel would not be produced in the quantities that would leave huge quantities of excess fuel. What was left over from any testing could have additives added to bring it up to spec. The Americans and Brits custom blended their fuel on base. Were the Germans incapable of doing something so simple?

That guarentee is for the minimum quality of the fuel.

Crumpp · « **Reply #48 on:** December 17, 2004, 05:35:32 PM »

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You did say EXPERIMENTAL. Experimental(test) fuel would not be produced in the quantities that would leave huge quantities of excess fuel. What was left over from any testing could have additives added to bring it up to spec. The Americans and Brits custom blended their fuel on base. Were the Germans incapable of doing something so simple?

No Milo I said they were doing some experimenting at this time and I imagine that this helped to attribute to a larger than normal stocks of inferior grade fuel.
I said nothing of them using experimental fuel.

Read the article. It says "usually" it could be brought up to specs.

Whether these experiments contributed to increasing inferior grade fuel is a matter of specualtion. Facts are just making fuel will leave even the same octane rating divided into superior and inferior fuels. Please read up on the process more.

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That guarentee is for the minimum quality of the fuel.

Exactly!! Point made.

Crumpp

stantond · « **Reply #49 on:** December 17, 2004, 06:40:00 PM »

Here is a link to a BMW801A engine article in pdf format. It's not in german though.

http://www.enginehistory.org/German/BMW/BMW801.pdf

Regards,

Malta

Crumpp · « **Reply #50 on:** December 18, 2004, 07:07:12 AM »

Can't get the link to work.

Crumpp

Naudet · « **Reply #51 on:** December 18, 2004, 08:41:28 AM »

Milo, look sharply at the drawing you posted.
You can see the bottom hatch through which the tank was installed/removed.
This hatch was enlarged for the A8, so the aux tank would pass through.

Btw on the drawing you can also see that the distance between the forward oxygen bottles is wider than the diameter of the tank.
You might not know it, but ALL fuel tanks of the FW190 could be easily removed as they are held in place by a number of straps and large enough access hatches are all over the plane.
Instead of constantly guessing was is or is not possible do some research.

MiloMorai · « **Reply #52 on:** December 18, 2004, 11:00:27 AM »

Naudet,

look again, more closely this time, at the drawing at the position of the forward of the 3 oxygen spheres. The distance is 455mm (to the closest 5mm). The spacing of the forward spheres is narrower than the dia of the tank. Also look at the side elevation for the position of the oxygen spheres.

And, yes I know that the tank came out through the bottom hatch, as I have said.

The forward fuel tank had 2 straps while the rear fuel had 4 straps to hold then in position. Access was by 2 rectangular removable panels which spanned a distance from the MG151/20 ammo hatches to frame 8. The hatches were held in place by 41 Dzus connecters.

Crumpp · « **Reply #53 on:** December 18, 2004, 10:13:29 PM »

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The distance is 455mm (to the closest 5mm). The spacing of the forward spheres is narrower than the dia of the tank. Also look at the side elevation for the position of the oxygen spheres.

And you are getting this off of a drawing?

Crumpp

MiloMorai · « **Reply #54 on:** December 18, 2004, 10:53:35 PM »

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Originally posted by Crumpp
And you are getting this off of a drawing?

Crumpp

Not very bright when it comes to draughting, are you Crumpp. Figures.

Crumpp · « **Reply #55 on:** December 18, 2004, 11:44:38 PM »

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Not very bright when it comes to draughting, are you Crumpp. Figures

No I just think it pretty funny. You have drawings. I have the real thing and loads of documentation, including the operating instructions. The tank was removable and it frequently was removed.

Crumpp

MiloMorai · « **Reply #56 on:** December 19, 2004, 07:13:33 AM »

What is amusing is that you cannot explain how the tank got past the oxygen cylinders. Puts into question whether you have a 190 parked in your backyard?

Should be no problem for you to go amd remove the tank and then explain how you got the tank past the oxygen sheres in 5 minutes.

Or if your access to a 190 is more restricted, one of those 1000's of pages of manuals should have instruction, besides 'remove through lower hatch.

Or you can go and ask one of those numerous veteran mechanics you claim to have talked to.

I see in your inability to answer, a dung dropper.

Crumpp · « **Reply #57 on:** December 20, 2004, 07:26:26 PM »

I think it is explained in the other thread, Milo.

Crumpp

Naudet · « **Reply #58 on:** December 21, 2004, 04:33:29 AM »

Milo, go get the FW190A7-A9 aircraft handbook, than read Part 7, pages 29 & 31 they should end your confusion.
The entire remove & installation procedure for the auxilary fuselage tank is described there. And no removal of the oxygen bottles is mentioned.

But then again you might come here and tell us the FW190A manual is just a german piece of propaganda, that ignores the fact that in your honest oppinion the auxilary fuselage tank would never get past the oxygen bottles.

P.S.: And please Milo, don't again refer to whatever drawing you provide here to convince me what was or was not possible. If i have to choose between the original aircraft handbook or a post-war drawing, i will always trust the original.

MiloMorai · « **Reply #59 on:** December 21, 2004, 06:36:12 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Naudet
Milo, go get the FW190A7-A9 aircraft handbook, than read Part 7, pages 29 & 31 they should end your confusion.
The entire remove & installation procedure for the auxilary fuselage tank is described there. And no removal of the oxygen bottles is mentioned.

But then again you might come here and tell us the FW190A manual is just a german piece of propaganda, that ignores the fact that in your honest oppinion the auxilary fuselage tank would never get past the oxygen bottles.

P.S.: And please Milo, don't again refer to whatever drawing you provide here to convince me what was or was not possible. If i have to choose between the original aircraft handbook or a post-war drawing, i will always trust the original.

Crumpp, what date was that post in the other thread? What is the date of the post in this thread? Why did it take 48hrs for you to finally post in this thread after I asked for a more detailed description? It was nice of you to finally post that more detailed description even though it was in another thread. Anyways, ta.

Now Naudet, who put the bee in your drawers? Are you upset because you can't 'read' a standard drawing(blueprint)?

Those drawings are acknowledged as the best Fw190 drawings done by a world respected draughtman. They were drawn using ORIGINAL Fw documenration.

Now let me quote Crumpp for you:
"I said it does not mention having to remove them in the Flugzeug-handbuch and the guys who removed the tank at White 1 do not remember having to remove them either.

The cylinders are mounted with quick release buckles, two per bank. Pop those and the bracket clips into the section span. Lift it up and move it and set the O2 clylinders out of the way (the line is flexible and still attached). Remove the Aux tank. That is if you have the rubber coated self sealing sleeve. The bare metal just slides right out."

So Naudet, it would seem that the manual was not updated when the rubber coated tank was used.

You might what to visit White 7 in the Smithsonian. The photos I have seen of this a/c show that the rubber coated tank will not fit past the tanks unless what Crumpp described is done.

Crumpp, that pic you linked to shows a bare tank. Is that out of White 1?

You are correct Naudet. I take the manuals to the outhouse to use as you know what, for sure.