Duplicate Squads

[lambo31]

Originally posted by 68DevilM
bad form

takes away some identity from the squad's

absolutely correct 68Devil.


Any squad, whether made up like the 412 or based on a real WWII squad like the 325th shouldn't be copied.


Lambo

[ALF]

Originally posted by lambo31
absolutely correct 68Devil.


Any squad, whether made up like the 412 or based on a real WWII squad like the 325th shouldn't be copied.
 

As Ive stated before its not good to have names so similar they are easily confused, however, there is no reason to assume that any one person who decides to create a squadron owns the rights to that squadron, especially when you choose to use one of the 10 most recognizable ones (Blacksheep, FLying Tigers, Checkertails etc)

If you want to have a completely unique squadron then make one up......
 

If you choose to base your squadron on a popular historical one then you must deal with the reality that your not the only person on the planet who may want to use that popular squadrons monicker and you have no particular right of exclusivity.


Good stories have multiple movies made about them.......should the very first film made about something be the only one ever allowed?  Good squdrons will be duplicated, and so long as its clear they are seperate squadrons based on the same real squad....there is no reason to complain.

[WarLover]

I think there are a couple of questions here:

1) Is choosing the name of a historical squadron "wannabeism"? I personally think it a homage to the real people who risked and in many cases gave their lives for their country. Choosing a historical squadron name only helps to keep that unit's name and those deeds alive even as the survivors of those units fade into history.  If this isn't part of what AH is about, then why do we worry so much about historical skins? Why don't we just fly bare metal? For that matter why do we spend so much time arguing about the modeling of the historic flight performance? Its because the historical aspect is important.

2) Where do we draw the line on duplicate squad names?  This is the real issue here. It seems to me that the first group which chooses to use a numbered, historical squadron name in AH should have priority on that name as long as they remain active. This concept of first choice is very similar to what we use with call-signs. With literally hundreds of historical squadrons to choose from, it doesn't seem unreasonable to require unique numbered squadron names in AH. It's also a good way to make sure we don't wind up with ten squadrons all trying to emmulate a historical unit with minor spelling changes. That would be really confusing in places like SEA where changes to orders are often given by unit. With ToD coming down the pike, this is something that will need to be addressed sooner or later.

[TequilaChaser]

Originally posted by Cobra412
TC obviously you don't know your history. There is no such thing as the 412th Braunco Mustangs in WWII.   Oh and TC I'd think trying to take a fictional squads name is a bit more lame then a real squadrons name.  Just means you lack any imagination.
 
Stream as you can see though TC feels the same as I do.

   

Cobra I never said your squad was real, or named after a real squad, your second part to me, where you think it is lame at taking a fictional squads name is what I was actually getting at, regardless if you are in or have a Squad named after real life squad or is a fictional named squad it is RUDE, LAME, Unsportsman like, and shows one has no ethics or morals if one decides to name their squad after another squad that already exist in the game, one should confront the squad and talk about it and come to a conclusion before out right taking on another squads name.......talking with in the game here of course

I did get the reaction I was looking for though, you said don't be selfish, then you said it was lame to name after another squad. My post was about both Real/Historical and Fictional names

now you know how I really feel about it!

oh and the Checkertails VFG is Virtual Fighter Group, so they are  flying as a virtual squad in rememberance of the real squad, Stream maybe all of you can merge together, if all the Checkertail squads are for the same thing and get along with each other, then you can have the same identical squad name with no difference, just a thought

[Cobra412]

TC so basically what your saying is your a troll that only tries to a rise out of someone?  Who is it again that has no morals?

TC no morals or sportsmanship?  You have to be kidding me with this statement.  This game hasn't shown one ounce of either of these items since I started playing and I'd say 98% of the people playing it could give a rats arse about them either.  Look at some of the individual names that are in the game or even some of the squad names that pop up.  I'm not going to sit here and name them all off but just how do they fit into your moral standards?  I'm sure your running to HTC screaming about how they are immoral and they should be changed.    

How often do you see any kind of sportsmanship in the game?  In your eyes I'm sure you'd think the 2, 3 , and 4 on 1 engagements that happen here are sportsman like.  I'm sure when your on the side with that advantage you let your opponent exit the fight even after that person fought long and hard against overwhelming odds and their aircraft just can't do battle anymore.  I can say without a doubt very few if anyone in this game has ever done such a thing.  Why?  Because as usual people here are selfish and think only of themselves or their squads.  It's not about having sportsmanship it's about the kill, what it does for their ratings. and how many perk points they get for that run.  Go preach sportsmanship and morals to some naive new person who may actually listen.  They'll soon come to their own conclusion that there is no such thing in Aces High and become just like the other 98% of the AH population.

Warlover again it's not your name so you have no rights to it.  It has nothing to do with how we choose our callsigns.  SEA and TOD also have nothing to do with this.  If the CO off the frame can't pay enough attention to detail to ensure the right squad gets the right orders then maybe they shouldn't be the CO in the first place.  As it stands right now IIRC TOD will have nothing to do with each individual squad in Aces High.  This may be something hard for some folks to understand but TOD isn't just about the individual and their individual MA squadrons.  It's about how everyone in the missions do as a whole.  It's not about waving your virtual squadron flag after you got a ton of kills at the expense of some other person or persons on your side.  It's about putting your arse on the line and possibly taking one for the team in order to accomplish the mission objective even if it means you don't get your precious kills and get to wave your MA squadron flag.  Hopefully HTC will leave individual squadrons out of TOD so people will start giving a crap about everyone on their side and not just their squad mates or close MA buds.

[elc7367b]

Cobra, sportsmanship is there, although rare.  You exhibited it to me by letting me land a pilot wounded craft.  I believe I exhibited to you be trying to seperate ourselves from the melee to have an even engagement.  I have saluted you for this.  

Now the 3 and 4 on 1 engagements, although not necessarily sporting are not in bad form either.  I have engaged multiple aircraft while solo too many times to count.  I know more likely than not that I will die.  It was my choice to engage to begin with.  When I see one con being engaged by many, I usually sit  back and ask my countryman if he is doing all right or needs help.  If he says he is fine, I watch.  If he says he needs help, I will jump in.  I dont think it is not sporting, its just doing what needs to be done to save the countryman.

Muttman

[Vudak]

Man Cobra you're so darn sensitive!

Chill! Go shoot a lala! Makes you feel better!

[Dawggus]

I'm not too worried about Squad Names, but I'll be danged if I'm sharing the with another Squad, especially one with obscene handles .

Inside joke about an old discussion the BadCats and Mares had in AWFR .  These things always smooth themselves out over time, it's only a game.

Cya Up!

Dawg

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by Tilt


what is more inpolite    assuming the mantle of some hero/heroic squadron or copying the name of an existing AH squad?

 

Copying the name of a squadron that already exists in the game would be.  

How can it be inpolite to use a squadrons name if the surviving members of that unit think it is a good thing that we're keeping that part of their history alive and encourage us?


ack-ack

[Furious]

Originally posted by o0Stream140o
I was just wondering what the protocol, on duplicate squads?  I see that there is now a 325th "Checker Tail" sqaudron in MA.  I am not happy with this. I have been a 325th FG "Checkertail Clan" for 3 years and have had my squad in MA for at least 2 of those years...

You should sue.

[TequilaChaser]

Originally posted by Cobra412
BUNCH OF BULLCHIT

not listening dude!

you posted  why should Stream14 care if another group wanted to name their squad the same, that he should not be selfish, then posted using a fictisious sqd name that already exist was Lame or Rude, a name is a name real or fictisious so I was pointing out you did not care and thought nothing of Stream14's squad name being duplicated, but when it came to your own squad name you got all uppity about it......

I never regarded my post toward morals or sportsmanship in reference to what happens "in the game" jackarse, and no I am no troll, I am TC.......

my morals , sportsmanship was in reference to using squad names.......

the biggest thing I see out of everything you post and have posted lately is that you are turning into a BIG WHINER!

you was much more a gentlemen a year ago and I find it sad that you have let others that fly in the game suck you down to their level of pitty!

an example of morals, ethics, sportsmanship: can be found in the training /help forum where Hajo let me go after I had fought of 4 or 5 planes( watch the film ),  and you don't know what I do or how I treat others by 1st hand knowledge Cobra, so your false statements and thoughts opinions don't mean nadda!

with that said, Merry christmas and Hapy New Year Cobra, hope you don't let my thoughts get you all jacked out of shape any more than you already are!

[Tilt]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
How can it be inpolite to use a squadrons name if the surviving members of that unit think it is a good thing that we're keeping that part of their history alive and encourage us?


 

Given that some folks think you are honoring them (as you may be) then I think you are lucky they may encourage you.

However if you were a member of some famous organisation and I decided that its good name was one that I would like to use to identify me or my group in some game......and then just did it without reference to you.....might not my actions be somewhat inpolite.

and then given that some one else takes the same name in the same game ...............has the 2nd person been more inpolite to me than I was to you?

My view is that if I took the CPID JJohnson and called my squad the Tangmere Bunch I would be assuming alot and I would consider my self both presumptious and  somewhat inpolite.

Just because someone does good by the original and honours them etc such that they gain encouragment....... it does not alter that this is all after the fact.  This fact being that this mantle was just assumed regardless of any reference to the original.

Given all this it is very much a "norm" to take up such names in historic sims..... its no great insult.....quite often it may be solely to honour the original......quite often it may be  wannabe 'ism......who can tell what is in the mind when original names are assumed.

And it may even be that some folk do ask or refer or already know "its OK"........its possible I suppose.

[Cobra412]

Good for Hajo TC.  So exactly where is it you demonstrated good sportsmanship?  If Hajo let you go then I'd say Hajo showed good sportsmanship not the other way around.  TC trust me there is nothing you or any other fool on here could say to bring me down or get me jacked out of shape.  

Next time why don't you try sticking your fingers in your ears, run around in circles and scream I can't hear you over and over.    

Stream may be a good guy and frankly it's you who started throwing punches after I stated my opinion.  If someone can't take constructive criticism then it's not my problem.  I'll state it again as I did from the start.  You are selfish to think you are the only person that has the right to carry a name of any WWII squadron or any squadron from this day and age.  It's about time you guys stopped being such arrogant little children that don't want to share.  It's not yours to lay claim to.

[TequilaChaser]

was showing it existed , did not say I showed it,  although  you draw your on conclusions and say/type what  only what you want to believe........


I am not upset , mad , ill or have any beef with you Cobra.  

and I did mean it when I said Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you!

[Cobra412]

No offense TC but because a few folks show it doesn't mean much.  Only shows that persons character and doesn't speak for the community as a whole.

TC I'm not part of the 412th anymore.  I stepped down for my own reasons.  Nice try on bringing them into this though.  Maybe I should go around reading every squads "rules" and then come in here and bash each individual.  I'm sure I would have a huge list with alot of the "respectable" squads and their members on that list.  

all I was trying to show is that taking another squads name regardless of the name being fictional or real matters to others that already has the same name in the game

So I guess your showing alot of class by trying to bait people and then trying to make fools of them just to prove your point?