Originally posted by TequilaChaser
well, Shane had a good reason I guess to type what he did, but just because DmdChief got whipped up on then JJ169th, there is no reason to slam them like what has happened here........
#1 - they are my squad mates and I have seen them pull off some great fights even being out numbered.
#2 no one here watching the films knows if either one of them was flying fatigued, having a bad day, or trying to fight and talk on the phone at same time..thing is we just don't know
Shane is a good pilot, but the rest on here throwing out their opinions are probably not much better than the 2 downed pilots in the film, if you are better at all........
Nice way to slam someone by calling them noobs, clueless, seals, etc.......
Widewing, you are a "Class Act"
as far as sending them to the TA or DA because they got a spanking, are u saying Ghosth, or Ren, or Coach or others didn't do a good job for 1 of the fellows in the film?
I would be amazed if you could do any better flying with your best wingman verse Shane......
I guess it is easy to sit back and pick apart how another flys and gets killed , as long it isn't yourself!
to much BS in this thread!
TC, that film showed me two guys who did poorly. They both did just about everything wrong once they engaged. And yes, I was too harsh. And I apologize for that. Nonetheless, that doesn't mean I wasn't correct. You are right in that we don't know what other things influenced their flying. However, we can only judge what we do know and that's what we see in the film.
DMDChief started by not using the Hurricane's only performance asset from the outset. If he assumed that the F4U would not maneuver, then he had already screwed the pooch. Always assume the enemy is going to try to kill you. Had he pulled off power early and executed a vertical reverse on the merge, he would have had Shane cold as Shane's greater E would have left him exposed for a shot as he came over the top. Waiting to see what Shane did first was his doom.
I think DMDChief should think a bit more about what he plans to do to the enemy rather than react after the fact. I watched my nephew blow Chief out of the sky 4 times the other night because he kept reupping and flying suicide runs in a P-38. So, viewing this film only confirmed the impression that left. He's been flying for just 3 months or so. He could benefit from some additional ACM training.
jj169th is simply a new player with insufficient ACM training. Again, I apologize for being rude. jj, you are welcome to fly my wing in the TA while I beat the snot out of TC, then we can switch roles.
Seriously TC, you're a Trainer, train these guys for crissake, they're your squadies! Hell, tell me when and I'll help you. Geez, my squad spends a lot of time in the TA and DA. We work on every aspect of the game. I take individual squad members there and we work on basic ACM and tactics. I worked with SuperDud the other day. I flew the P-51B he had a SpitV. We had fights exactly like Shane and Chief did. SuperDud asked, "How the heck did you reverse onto my 6 so fast?" I both explained and demonstrated how to do it. SuperDud came back with "That's exactly what Furball did to me the other day!" Now he knows how to counter the vertical reverse well enough to give Furball a tougher time of in their next meeting. I coach my nephew when he flies by sitting next to him. Good 'ol Leviathn gave him a terrific lesson he won't be forgetting anytime soon. I got him to reup and go back, but he chickened out at the last minute, leaving me the unenviable task of getting his revenge. While he has learned enough to hold his own in the MA, he prefers GVs, buffs, shed bombing and manned guns. So, I let him do his thing, even if he porks my stats (which he does, but I frankly don't care much about scores). Now that Santa has provided him with a new computer, I expect he'll have his own account in January. He needs a handle, but didn't care for my suggestion: Megaputz.....
There's more to training than the quasi-nursery school program we generally have to run in the TA. Sure, there's a big need for teaching the basics of getting the airplane off and back onto the ground, of learning the various game functions. But that certainly does not produce players ready for the MA.
I like to take a few of these guys away from the base and work on things like managing their E, managing the merge, judging the enemy's E, determining intent and basic counters to attacks. We really need some sort of formalized advanced training. We simply do not stress SA enough either. SA is the real factor that creates the divide between good players and poor players. All the ACM skills in the world won't help you if you never see the enemy.
Confident players are better players and they enjoy the game more as a result.
Noobs simply fighting other noobs means that they never rise above the level of their competition. That breeds a false confidence. We need to be spending more time teaching these guys how to cope with what they will face in the MA. A few days ago Fester came into the TA to try the Ki-84 and shake off any rust. We had a blast furballing with his Ki-84 and my P-51B. Some of the noobs actually learned a few things by participating and watching. Fester let it be known that he was fair game and soon had a dozen noobs hard after him. Fester's comment was that "this is more fun than the MA!" Most of the new guys had fun too. They had a chance to mix it up with one of the game's better players without the social stigma of getting whacked in the MA and without having to re-plane after getting smacked. Two guys told me that they learned more fighting Fester than they had learned during months in the MA. One fellow filmed the whole thing and spent hours reviewing the film. When I last talked to him he said, "man, you can't imagine how much that helped me." Well, yes I can imagine that.
I've gone to the DA with Urchin where he schooled me on the merge about 10 times before I figured out his moves. That was invaluable to me. I'll gladly take a beating just to learn what guys like Lev, Urchin and Badboy already know. All three of these guys are willing to go to the DA and work with a player who sincerely wants to learn. That goes for Shane as well. Shane is always ready to help people learn ACM. I don't begrudge Shane his smack-talk, because he will turn around and spend hours of his time teaching the same guys he just ragged, and do it gladly.
That is the stuff we should be teaching noobs before they find themselves in the MA getting their butts kicked. But, the noobs themselves have to realize that they need training and ask for help. The general level of ACM skills HAS deteriorated over the past few years. Thankfully, we have more and more of the skilled players dropping into the TA and are sharing their experience. Badboy is in there frequently. Hammer is back with the trainer corps and is a huge asset. Ghosth loves to teach ACM, and he's a good teacher. Fuseman's always working his butt off with new players. I don't see much of TC, Ren or the others, probably because we have vastly differing schedules.
What we really need is more of the better players to take an interest in the new players. Come to the TA and work with them for an hour here and there. Yeah, I know the TA lacks exploding planes, but the benefit comes from elevating the general level of play in the MA. Speaking just for myself, I'm always grateful for the help because I must spend much of my time teaching the absolute basics. Anytime I see Badboy in the TA I know that the new players will have a skilled player to teach them some ACM and SA. The rest of you can make a difference too.
My regards,
Widewing
