Author Topic: Stupid math tricks and nicotine addiction (Read 1546 times)

Jackal1 · « **Reply #30 on:** January 04, 2005, 07:41:07 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Gunslinger
IE what is a good measure of addiction.....the amount of people it addicts, or the amount that an individual wants/needs it?

Either scenario above would be caffiene , hands down.
I think maybe you are relating more to withdrawal or mortality instead of addiction. Apples and oranges.

Gunslinger · « **Reply #31 on:** January 04, 2005, 07:57:09 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Jackal1
Either scenario above would be caffiene , hands down.
I think maybe you are relating more to withdrawal or mortality instead of addiction. Apples and oranges.

true but if somone was a heroin addict that also liked coffee and could put the coffee down but not the heroin wouldnt that make heroin more addictive. I'm also thinking along the lines of Chemical addiction were the body NEEDs the drugs in order to function. I know coffee is addictive but I can do without it. I cant however go too long without a smoke before I start to get real edgy. Take them both away from me and I'm unbearable.

Nash · « **Reply #32 on:** January 04, 2005, 08:22:56 PM »

Coffee/smokes as addictive as heroin? What world are you living in?

Yeah... I remember pawning my G5 for 80 bucks because I was jonesin' for a rich and full bodied Starbucks coffee. Yegads... there is no comparison. None, zip, zilch, nada.

By about the 2nd month clean from heroin, you finally start feeling something comparable to the 2nd day without smokes. Coffee? Come on...

The number of people drinking coffee (or smoking for that matter), as compared to the number of drug addicts, only has anything to do with their addictive qualities in as much as most intelligent people wouldn't get started with heroin because of its addictive qualities. Plus it's against the law. Plus it's expensive. Plus it's hard to get. Plus it's taboo. Plus it's far more unhealthy.

So that comparison is useless.

How long does it take to work up a gripping physical and psychological dependancy on coffee/smokes/heroin? And once that dependancy has nestled in, to what lengths - what absolutely mind-bendingly stupid extremes - will you go to in order to feed it?

Those are the pertinent questions if you want to compare the addictive qualities of various things.

YMMV - mine didn't.

Gunslinger · « **Reply #33 on:** January 04, 2005, 08:33:06 PM »

That's pretty much how I think nash, but I keep hearing all of these "statistics" and it makes me wonder about the numbers and the yardstick used.

Yes more people die from smoking every year BUT more people smoke than shoot heroin. More people drink coffee than smoke but less die as a result of it and more people can go without it.

Jackal1 · « **Reply #34 on:** January 04, 2005, 10:22:29 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Nash
Coffee/smokes as addictive as heroin? What world are you living in?

Yeah... I remember pawning my G5 for 80 bucks because I was jonesin' for a rich and full bodied Starbucks coffee. Yegads... there is no comparison. None, zip, zilch, nada.

By about the 2nd month clean from heroin, you finally start feeling something comparable to the 2nd day without smokes. Coffee? Come on...

The number of people drinking coffee (or smoking for that matter), as compared to the number of drug addicts, only has anything to do with their addictive qualities in as much as most intelligent people wouldn't get started with heroin because of its addictive qualities. Plus it's against the law. Plus it's expensive. Plus it's hard to get. Plus it's taboo. Plus it's far more unhealthy.

So that comparison is useless.

How long does it take to work up a gripping physical and psychological dependancy on coffee/smokes/heroin? And once that dependancy has nestled in, to what lengths - what absolutely mind-bendingly stupid extremes - will you go to in order to feed it?

Those are the pertinent questions if you want to compare the addictive qualities of various things.

YMMV - mine didn't.

You also are comparing withdrawal to addiction. Not the same ballpark. Apples, oranges.

Gunslinger · « **Reply #35 on:** January 04, 2005, 10:25:01 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Jackal1
You also are comparing withdrawal to addiction. Not the same ballpark. Apples, oranges.

well my friend lets compare apples to apples.....

what would somone jones for a coffee at 7:30AM do to go get one?

What would a crack head or heroin junky do at midnight if he hadnt got his fix all day.

THAT to me would be a measure of addiction. Plus isn't addiction also defined by what happens if you don't get it. The body does get Chemically addicted to things wich CAUSES withdrawls if it doesnt get it.

NUKE · « **Reply #36 on:** January 04, 2005, 10:27:48 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Jackal1
You also are comparing withdrawal to addiction. Not the same ballpark. Apples, oranges.

Actually, he made a pretty clear case for the addiction part. How many people would sell everything they own to get a cup of coffee for a fix?

That's addiction.

Jackal1 · « **Reply #37 on:** January 04, 2005, 10:30:28 PM »

From Addiction Defined:

Global consumption has been estimated to be 120,000 tonnes per annum. This is the approximate equivalent of one caffeine-containing beverage per day for each of the planet's 5 billion plus inhabitants. So, caffeine is almost certainly the most widely consumed psycho-active substance in the world.

Jackal1 · « **Reply #38 on:** January 04, 2005, 10:31:52 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by NUKE
Actually, he made a pretty clear case for the addiction part. How many people would sell everything they own to get a cup of coffee for a fix?

That's addiction.

The point being is they don`t have to. It`s readily available to all.

NUKE · « **Reply #39 on:** January 04, 2005, 10:34:48 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Jackal1
The point being is they don`t have to. It`s readily available to all.

Well, in our jails here in Phoenix, no coffee is allowed. Nobody freaks out or needs medical care because of it.

Nash · « **Reply #40 on:** January 04, 2005, 10:45:16 PM »

I tell ya what Jackal.

In order for your argument to make sense...

Imagine Junkbucks on damn near every street corner... A grande fix sans the chocolate sprinkles... and notice the turn society takes.

Just because lotsa people drink coffee doesn't mean anything. Lotsa people drive cars too. Are they addictive? By your measuring stick, what isn't?

Jackal1 · « **Reply #41 on:** January 04, 2005, 10:46:21 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by NUKE
Well, in our jails here in Phoenix, no coffee is allowed. Nobody freaks out or needs medical care because of it.

Yea, that`s the withdrawal end of it.

Jackal1 · « **Reply #42 on:** January 04, 2005, 10:48:38 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Nash
I tell ya what Jackal.

In order for your argument to make sense...

Imagine Junkbucks on damn near every street corner... A grande fix sans the chocolate sprinkles... and notice the turn society takes.

Just because lotsa people drink coffee doesn't mean anything. Lotsa people drive cars too. Are they addictive? By your measuring stick, what isn't?

I`ll tell ya what instead.
What you just posted makes absolutely no sense and has nothing to do with what we were discussing.

Nash · « **Reply #43 on:** January 04, 2005, 10:49:28 PM »

TweetyBird · « **Reply #44 on:** January 04, 2005, 10:58:12 PM »

I think nicotine is so bad because its usually a life long addiction with so many memories tied up in it. I've been a smoker for most of my life (33 of 46 years), and don't really know how to be a non smoker. I don't feel like me. But pain?? - blah - it aint bad. I've felt much worse, and where my thoughts may be be sluggish during withdrawal, I can do anything I normaly do. The physical withdrawal is nothing, and with all the alternative delivery forms (gum, patches, lozengers, inhalers etc.) its a cakewalk to wean oneself from nicotine. Now the psychological adiction is a biatch. I'm a smoker - always have been and always will be even if I aint smoking. I've smoked long enough so that if cancer is in the cards, quitting noww probably won't stop it. I'm quitting to try to prevent becomming a heart disease invalid. I'm getting to that age where heart disease is definite threat.

But boy I would LOVE a smoke right now...