HiTech can you explain why

[Wotan]

Originally posted by MANDO
You can argue about the procedure, but with D9 the effect is a perfect hammer head. With engine on I got nasty effects 2 of every 3 times.

Simply reversing direction isnt a 'hammerhead'.

If what you are doing is flying up until you run out of energy then falling back down then thats not a hammerhead.

Read what golfer is telling you:

During a hammerhead, the airplane does not "fall" onto its side, but it is flown around the apogee of the upline.

Read what Andy Bush describes. Then read what HT is telling you. A hammerhead isn't an easy maneuver and it will damn near impossible in AH with combat trim on.

Your question in this post was:

[why] is so difficult (or even impossible) to perfom correct hammer heads

Based on what you decribe as a 'hammerhead' makes it clear that you don't know what one is to begin with.

Just reversing is not a 'hammerhead'...

[hitech]

Make you a deal MANDO: come down to dallas I'll teach you how to do the real thing.

Btw that also goes for anyone else who happens to be in the area on a nice day.

HiTech

[Nuke33]

Originally posted by hitech
Make you a deal MANDO: come down to dallas I'll teach you how to do the real thing.

Btw that also goes for anyone else who happens to be in the area on a nice day.

HiTech

Hey I live in Dallas, I'm here on every nice day..

[Crumpp]

Interesting.

I find in AH backing off the throttle at the apogee and adding power back in as the nose comes around helps increase the rate at which the nose returns to target line.  As long as your above stall speed the drag helps increase turn rate.

I don't cut throttle but rather back off and add it back in.  I will even hit wep once the aircraft is back in the dive.

Am I wrong?

Crumpp

[Wotan]

In the G-10 in AH1 I had to pull the power back to about 50% or so. But this was steady back until 45 degrees then back up, no wep though. In the G-6 and G-2 I didn't touch the throttle.

I don't know about AH2 since I haven't tried it.

[mars01]

Make you a deal MANDO: come down to dallas I'll teach you how to do the real thing.

Btw that also goes for anyone else who happens to be in the area on a nice day.

First time I ever wished I was in Texas 8).

[Straiga]

Mars01

It had a Lycoming Textron IGSO-540 Fuel Injected Supercharged. It had a 35 ft takeoff run. Its was an engine with a seat attached to it, you didnt need the wings. It was totally out there.
 
The crank broke at the number 1 jug journel.

I did compete but not offen, When I was younger. Thats a tough road follow.

Straiga

[Naudet]

Wotan,

today i got my simpeds, finally i have back rudder control.

Tried to hammerhead the D9 both offline and online, using the method you posted here.

Outcome is an inevitable spin. Once the plane is down to 120-100 mph and you put in the rudder, the plane stalls violently, also the induced roll movement through the rudder use, cannot be countered by aileron.

As the only other "Flightsim" i currently have on HDD is WW2Online, i tried out a couple of HHs there and it work.
Most were not really "clean" and for an airshow i would have to train a bit, but atleast the plane acted as expected.
Also i noticed it is much easier to maintain the right amount of forward pressure in WW2OL to go straight up, something atm almost inpossible for me in AH2.


EDIT: Just practised a bit more. Could not get the D9 to go over the wing. Look at it from outside and it seemed like the nose would not drop more than 45-60° to the side, but than suddenly it stays that way and stalls.
Once the D9 fell back (nose still up) through the smoke about 30m and than suddenly snaped around it's nose and went down.
Even tried to initiated the HH at a somewhat higher speed, but again, no nose drop.
Than i went to the hangar and took a P51 up. Was pretty tough to get P51 going straight up, because the elevator felt slow to react and the it had a tendeny to drop over the head. But finally i managed it and got her to hammerhead. No perfect ones, but atleast the P51 would go over the wing entirely. (Note: P51's AUX tank was empty).

[Wotan]

Hiya Naudet,

I haven't flown much of AH2. I did the betas and the first 2 tours but dropped my AH account. I mostly flew the G-6 during this time. I can't claim to know about doing hammerheads in AH2, especially in the D-9.

I remember from AH1 to make sure CT is off and neutralize trim.

Last night I was flying in FB/AEP/PF in a Ta-152H-0 and we were met at 7000m by 6 P-51s on the War clouds server. After dancing a bit we killed 2 of the 51s and split the others up.

I dove down on a P-51 at 6500m but missed and another 51 slipped in behind me. I was much faster and climbed into vertical.. He pulled up and sprayed like P-51 pilots do in all sims but stalled out and mushed over. I tried to hammerhead back down but got into a vicious spin and fell all the way down to 2000m before I recovered.

I hit MW-50 and fire walled the throttle and escaped.

I may re-install Ah-2 and give a try and see if I can do it them in the Ah2 D-9.

While you are flying around Ah in the D-9 check out my JG-2 D-9 skin (listed as by Batz).

[Naudet]

Hehe, i'm actually waiting for someone to do a JV44 Platzschutzstaffel Skin for the D9. Sadly i am not familar enough with PSP to do it myself.

Wota, i remember that using this procedure i were able to HH in AH1, in FA3, IL2:Fb and WW2OL.

[Wotan]

A Platzschutzstaffel skin in AH2 is currenlty impossible to do correctly due to the stretching and mirroring of the templates.

All the aircraft will eventually be updated so that this mirroring and stretching will be gone (like the Ki-84). Until then I wouldn't expect a Platzschutzstaffel skin. The underside red / white stripping is impossible.

[Golfer]

I just got finished recording a film using a P-51D and A6M5 and nearly pulling off a hammerhead.

There are a few that could legitimately be called hammer heads, though each time (because the airplanes are not specifically designed for aerobatics) I ran out of one control or another.

I need someone to host the film, please email me and I will send the film

Thanks

[Blue Mako]

Originally posted by MANDO
Actually with Fw190D9, I perform pretty good HH in the following way:

1 - start the zoom up and keep both wingtips at the same distance of the horizon.
2 - Once near stall, try to be sure that the plane is not rolling neither yawing at all. If not possible, try to minimize these rotations.
4 - Cut engine and dont touch any control until nose drops.
5 - Start engine while the nose is falling below the horizon.

This method results in a nasty flotating effect with 110G and some other planes. With 190A8 the umpowered reversal is slower than with D9.

This is not a hammerhead.

The correct way to execute a hammerhead is, as noted by Wotan/Andy Bush (I saw after I typed the description below so I'm leaving it in):

1. Zoom into a vertical climb with forward stick to remain at zero g.

2. Keep engine at medium to high power (engine power is needed to provide prop wash over rudder to maintain control effectiveness)

3. At low speed apply full rudder in desired direction (prop wash will keep rudder effective), full aileron opposite to rudder and hold forward stick.

4. Relax the controls as you are approach vertical nose down

5. Pull out of dive.

[MANDO]

Blue Mako,
do you mean that the procedure is not the correct one? or that the end result is not a hammer head?

The question here is not how to execute correct hammer-heads in real planes, but in AH2 planes. Following the engine-off procedure I got far better results than with Wotan procedure.

[Blue Mako]

MANDO your procedure is NOT a hammerhead.  You describe doing a nose over with the engine shut off (or idling).

There is no difference in the procedure for a hammerhead in real aircraft or AH aircraft.  Like golfer and HT I have some experience with aerobatics IRL (less time than either though I'm sure) so this is not an empty statement.

Wotan has posted the correct procedure, I was agreeing with it.  If you want to do a hammerhead correctly, follow it...