Author Topic: The Russians are coming.....  (Read 2300 times)

Offline Overlag

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The Russians are coming.....
« Reply #45 on: February 15, 2005, 01:00:08 PM »
perk the la7, p51 and anything under 15 ENY with one perk point at least... then the perks get automaticaly used, and the newbies wont be able to fly uber planes
Adam Webb - 71st (Eagle) Squadron RAF Wing B
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Offline Furball

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« Reply #46 on: February 15, 2005, 01:00:49 PM »
Gotta love Lavochkins... beautiful aeroplanes.


I am not ashamed to confess that I am ignorant of what I do not know.
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Offline dedalos

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« Reply #47 on: February 15, 2005, 01:01:06 PM »
Well, my opinion about the LA7 (I know you care).  LA7s will give you a fight and they don't pull those undescribable moves the 190s do.  If you perk the LA7 then as a matter of prinsipal, HT should disable atlist the D9s.  Yes, I do understand that not everyone is using a D9 the same way, but it seems that because some guys HO using an LA7 then all LA7 drivers are doing it?  Have you met a MOSS yet?

In any case.  LA7s will give you a fight.  D9s will run for ever, BnZ, for ever, HO on every pass, and stickstir you to death if you actually catch them.  I don;t understand why the LA7 gets all the griff  (because it Russian maybe? the source of all evil?).  

Lose the La7 an dthe D9s will be untouchable
Quote from: 2bighorn on December 15, 2010 at 03:46:18 PM
Dedalos pretty much ruined DA.

Offline Howitzer

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« Reply #48 on: February 15, 2005, 01:04:34 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by dedalos
Well, my opinion about the LA7 (I know you care).  LA7s will give you a fight and they don't pull those undescribable moves the 190s do.  If you perk the LA7 then as a matter of prinsipal, HT should disable atlist the D9s.  Yes, I do understand that not everyone is using a D9 the same way, but it seems that because some guys HO using an LA7 then all LA7 drivers are doing it?  Have you met a MOSS yet?

In any case.  LA7s will give you a fight.  D9s will run for ever, BnZ, for ever, HO on every pass, and stickstir you to death if you actually catch them.  I don;t understand why the LA7 gets all the griff  (because it Russian maybe? the source of all evil?).  

Lose the La7 an dthe D9s will be untouchable


Exactly why I'm always suspicious of 110s in the area, unless I hear of some JBs around.  I ALWAYS make sure I'm on their 6, because more times than not, they will try and turn just enough to HO you.  Notice this especially when trying to take a base... be leary of the gent who ups a 110 in base defense  =)

Offline Guppy35

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« Reply #49 on: February 15, 2005, 01:05:15 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by dedalos
Well, my opinion about the LA7 (I know you care).  LA7s will give you a fight and they don't pull those undescribable moves the 190s do.  If you perk the LA7 then as a matter of prinsipal, HT should disable atlist the D9s.  Yes, I do understand that not everyone is using a D9 the same way, but it seems that because some guys HO using an LA7 then all LA7 drivers are doing it?  Have you met a MOSS yet?

In any case.  LA7s will give you a fight.  D9s will run for ever, BnZ, for ever, HO on every pass, and stickstir you to death if you actually catch them.  I don;t understand why the LA7 gets all the griff  (because it Russian maybe? the source of all evil?).  

Lose the La7 an dthe D9s will be untouchable


I think the LA7s get the greif because they seem to be either blowing in very fast or blowing out very fast from a fight.

Back in the AW days it was the D9 everyone bashed because you never saw it unless it was going light speed.

I know guys turn in the LA7 but in general it seems like you see them roaring in late to the fight, shooting and running.

The advantage or disadvantage of that low alt speed capability depending on your point of view :)

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Offline killnu

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« Reply #50 on: February 15, 2005, 01:12:40 PM »
edited, wont hijack.
Karma, it follows you every where you go...

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Offline Tilt

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« Reply #51 on: February 15, 2005, 01:18:41 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Furious
My understanding is that the ASh-82 (previosly M-82) was a short cylinder version of the M-81 and that the M-81 was a (or a derivitive of a) 14 cylinder Wright R-2600.

 


I know at least 2 web sites that say this as does Yefim Gordon

Well there is some disagreement about this too.......but its clear that all Shvetov's designs were spawned from Wrights technology as he held various licenses..........

below is one critique of Yifim Gordons assumption that the Ash82 was a short Wrights Cyclone.............

Opinions of

Ilya Grinberg, Erik Pilawskii


The hoary old Western myth that the Shvetsov M-82 radial was even remotely related to the Wright Cyclone is preposterous in the extreme, and unworthy of repetition by such distinguished researchers. The M-25 was indeed a license-built R-1820, but it was in production only very briefly before the considerably modified M-25A supplanted it. Further development of the M-25A and -25V resulted in the M-62 and M-63 motors, but that was basically the extent of the development of this family of aero engines. The 14 cylinder M-82 was an entirely original Shvetsov design, perhaps conceptually influenced-- as were all European 14 cylinder radials (BMW 801, Hispano-Suiza 14M, FIAT A74, etc.)-- by the French Gnome-Rhone 14B radial of 1932.

Whilst the cylinder dia was identical to the R-2600 (155.5mm) if you start to look at pictures of the crank housing etc you will begin to pick up gross differences............

my view is that Shvetsov was well intol his 3rd or 4th serial engine development in the M 82 and his earlier ones were straight licensed copies........ he would of been well aware in 37 of the R-2600 and its potential.

The idea that the M 82 was a copy of  the BMW just does not gel........ Shvetsov had no technology agreement with BMW.


Sorry about the hijack............. but common misconceptions  were being aired
« Last Edit: February 15, 2005, 01:22:01 PM by Tilt »
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Offline dedalos

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« Reply #52 on: February 15, 2005, 01:27:07 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Guppy35


Agreed, don't get me wrong they can and will run.  Its just that some how its different for them.  They are low and they are in the fight (even if they are fast).  Prolly that is why the get you, the ar ein the fight. A D9 will dive in from 10K, you may or may not see a few tracers, and chances are you will never see it again.  Another thing is, the lala does not have the fuel to clime to 20K and wait for a cherry pick.  You will either use it to defend a base or to attack a base.  In either case you will be on the deck with all kinds of planes diving on you.  You will have about 5 minutes of fuel to get some kills and RTB.

I know I am bashing the 190 drivers but that not my intent.  There are some really good 190 drivers out there.  I am not talking about them.  This not a comparison of the people but rather a comp of how the two planes could be and are used.  I have some films that describe what I am talking (ok, I have a lot, ALT-R gets hit when I see a 190 to record the stick stiring, lol) about but I don;t want to post them with the pilot names in.
Quote from: 2bighorn on December 15, 2010 at 03:46:18 PM
Dedalos pretty much ruined DA.

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« Reply #53 on: February 15, 2005, 01:27:43 PM »
Nice photo of the Breitling La9 furball.

Offline Glasses

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« Reply #54 on: February 15, 2005, 01:29:35 PM »
D-9 and La7 are the MAs 2 "Altenative" lifestyle brethren. One runs at high alts the other runs at any alt.

You take one and take the other as well as the Pony. those 3 are the  sprinters in the MA, you take any out and you unbalance the  situation.

If the La la would be given a small perk for the 3 gun package that was as rare as a (something hypocritically correct is being said so I won't say it)  so it justifies that perhaps that might be the solution to the La la la la lal lallalalalalalalalallallalala lala...la problem.

Offline Vad

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« Reply #55 on: February 15, 2005, 01:36:04 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Overlag
perk the la7, p51 and anything under 15 ENY with one perk point at least... then the perks get automaticaly used, and the newbies wont be able to fly uber planes


Perfect! Newbies won't fly at all. Imagine frustration of new 2-weeks player who doesn't have any skills, is killed almost always and instantly, and can't even take a plane where he could get one accidental kill to get perk points. What do you think how long he would be playing?
I you want to have 10 players in MA at peak time you couldn't give better suggestion.

Offline 2bighorn

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« Reply #56 on: February 15, 2005, 01:37:19 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Vad
It is not true. The predecessor of  Ash82 (former M-82) was R-1820-F3  "Cyclone" license on whish was bought by Soviet Union in 1933. Cyclone was produced in Soviet Union under the name M-25, but  Shevzov developed this engine, and a lot of modification were produced (M-62, M-63, M-70, M-71 and finally M-82). A lot of that modifications were taken from new modifications of Cyclone. For example, M-82 was analog of R-2600 Cyclone (I don't know did Soviet Union bought the license on this engine or just stole it). First Ash-82 was produced in spring, 1940.

BMW 801 was descendant of Pratt and Whitney radials engine produced under license in Germany on 1930's. This engine was released to production in December 1939, so it is just impossible that russians could make the first M-82 in spring 1940 if would be copy of 801.
Similarity with R-1820 ends in 60 series.
M-82 was completely new development and has very little in common with Wright engines.

It's true that BMW 114 and 132 were built under license, but saying that 801 was descendant of PW is a bit of a stretch.

Both ASh 82 and BMW 801 are considerably more compact in comparison to PW engines with similar power output.

EDIT: ups, Tilt beat me to it...
« Last Edit: February 15, 2005, 01:39:20 PM by 2bighorn »

Offline Vad

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« Reply #57 on: February 15, 2005, 02:00:43 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by 2bighorn
Similarity with R-1820 ends in 60 series.
M-82 was completely new development and has very little in common with Wright engines.

It's true that BMW 114 and 132 were built under license, but saying that 801 was descendant of PW is a bit of a stretch.

Both ASh 82 and BMW 801 are considerably more compact in comparison to PW engines with similar power output.

EDIT: ups, Tilt beat me to it...


Ok, agree. Hard to say about similarity of R-2600 and M-82, but ok, let leave details to specialists.

What I want to say that 801 and M-82 are absolutely different engines.

Offline StarOfAfrica2

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« Reply #58 on: February 15, 2005, 02:25:48 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Furball
Gotta love Lavochkins... beautiful aeroplanes.
 


Yep.  Like these.  :)  (although I like the LaGG-3 photo best, maybe because it looks more like a Yak lol )






Offline mars01

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« Reply #59 on: February 15, 2005, 03:03:55 PM »
God that plane is beautiful Furbe.

I'm dying for someone to make a skin for that first one Star.