can a P38 realy outturn a Spit9?

[simshell]

when i learned how to use the Flaps and turn off combat trim in the P38 i was able to outturn Spit9s and now i look to turnfight spit9s

i cant beat Spit5s and seafires tho in turnfights

so i ask could the P38 under 250 outturn Spit9s and later marks in Real life ?

[Widewing]

Originally posted by simshell
when i learned how to use the Flaps and turn off combat trim in the P38 i was able to outturn Spit9s and now i look to turnfight spit9s

i cant beat Spit5s and seafires tho in turnfights

so i ask could the P38 under 250 outturn Spit9s and later marks in Real life ?

No. Almost, but no. This assumes that both pilots are able to fully utilize their aircraft to their limits.

In Aces High, skill levels can vary widely. Outcomes of such fights can mislead one into believeing things that would not be if pilots all had equal skills.

My regards,

Widewing

[humble]

If you run film I'd bet you'll see that the spitty's you out turn are a tad faster...the spitty holds E better than the 38 and has no combat flaps...so a 38 will slow faster and can walk the flaps. The better spit drivers will do a better job of scrubbing off E and can out turn you (IMO). The spitty V & IIC are better turners but its E control as well....

[Grits]

Didnt you guys know that NOTHING out turns the P38? It it teh Uber! I'm sure a member of the 38 cult will be along soon with some pilots accounts to back me up.

[Morpheus]

Excellent reply widewing.

[killnu]

seems based on widewings post, that a p38 could out turn a spit9 under the right circumstances, so the answer to the question would be yes.

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by simshell
when i learned how to use the Flaps and turn off combat trim in the P38 i was able to outturn Spit9s and now i look to turnfight spit9s

i cant beat Spit5s and seafires tho in turnfights

so i ask could the P38 under 250 outturn Spit9s and later marks in Real life ?

There is the famous story of Lowell beating a Spitfire (think it was the recce version, maybe a Mk XI or a Mk XV) in a mock dogfight but no concrete, certifiable evidence.  In AH however, the P-38, properly flown can turn with a Spitfire Mk IX and Mk XIV quite easily.  If you're going to turn with the Mk IX, just make sure you're not doing it in the medium speed range, otherwise the Spitfire Mk IX will eat you alive.  Keep the turn fight at high speeds or at low speeds, approaching stall speed (below 150mph IAS) and you can work yourself into an angle for a shot.  Also be sure to keep the turn fight as much in the verticle as possible to take advantage of the P-38's vertical ability as well as to help burn the Spitfire's E to keep its speed down.  

There's plenty of films posted here from other P-38 pilots as well as myself on how to fight a Spitfire in the P-38.


ack-ack

[thrila]

ackack i've always been suspicious of that story because i've readso many different versions of it, labelling the spit a IX, XI, XIV and a XV.  Once i even read a version which the RAF pilot stated he would "whoop the p38 Lowell's ass", something i can't imagine an RAF pilot ever saying.

[Ack-Ack]

...hence the no concrete, certifiable evidence comment.



ack-ack

[Guppy35]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
There is the famous story of Lowell beating a Spitfire (think it was the recce version, maybe a Mk XI or a Mk XV) in a mock dogfight but no concrete, certifiable evidence.  In AH however, the P-38, properly flown can turn with a Spitfire Mk IX and Mk XIV quite easily.  If you're going to turn with the Mk IX, just make sure you're not doing it in the medium speed range, otherwise the Spitfire Mk IX will eat you alive.  Keep the turn fight at high speeds or at low speeds, approaching stall speed (below 150mph IAS) and you can work yourself into an angle for a shot.  Also be sure to keep the turn fight as much in the verticle as possible to take advantage of the P-38's vertical ability as well as to help burn the Spitfire's E to keep its speed down.  

There's plenty of films posted here from other P-38 pilots as well as myself on how to fight a Spitfire in the P-38.


ack-ack

Seems pretty clear it was a Spit XIV flown by a more senior RAF pilot.  Lowell mentions the 5 blade prop.

Lowell was also flying a light, 38L as in not full fuel, etc.

Keep in mind the Griffon Spit XIV was a much heavier beast then the 9 so that is a part of this too.

But I think the key is what Widewing refers too.  The quality of the pilot makes a huge difference.   Lowell knew the limits of the 38 and used it.  Pilots like Lynch, Bong, McGuire etc weren't afraid to get down and dirty with the more nimble Japanese fighters if the occasion arose.

Dan

[BUG_EAF322]

Yep u can turn with spits but better not to long.
A good spit pilot just knows what to do and than a good P38 pilot knows when to escape the fight.

I wouldnt stall fight guys like leviath.