Author Topic: Since you all know so much (Read 705 times)

TheManx · « **on:** April 01, 2005, 01:06:52 PM »

I'm looking for web sources that explain the 109's compression. I know in AH they compress quite easily, and would like a few sources as to understand why they did. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

SELECTOR · « **Reply #1 on:** April 01, 2005, 01:42:18 PM »

it was just the tech of the time.. as the need for more speed became the most important thing, the old designs like the 109 became a slave to compression...the 109 wasn't the only plane to suffer the p38 was almost cancelled at one point because of the compressabillity...it wasn't till laminar flow wings or dive flaps that the issue was partialy solved...

one solution to try in game is to use elevator trim up to help pull out of a dive..

Morpheus · « **Reply #2 on:** April 01, 2005, 01:48:20 PM »

I can't imagine what a nightmare/thrill/joy it was to fly something like the G10.

TheManx · « **Reply #3 on:** April 01, 2005, 01:48:52 PM »

Hey Selector! Thanks for the help bud. I actually use that when flying in-game, and used to fly the 38 fairly regularly when I was in Aces High...and smacked the ground on quite a few occasions due to the compression

I was just wondering if there was a web source which has statistical proof of at which point the 109's were supposed to compress. I did a little searching myself, and couldn't find a thing about it.

DaddyAck · « **Reply #4 on:** April 01, 2005, 02:05:41 PM »

109G-10 in game stats

This is a write up of the plane in question (as far as in game)

Howitzer · « **Reply #5 on:** April 01, 2005, 02:10:57 PM »

I think what he is asking, is what data did HTC use to model the 109, and in that data is this tendency for compression documented?

Manx, you may want to try and run a similar post in the Aircraft/Vehicles section, there are few guys in there that are LW experts, and I think Selector may be one of them. Wish I could think of the others. Dan/Guppy may be of help as well... he knows british planes, but I know he has data on some LW as well. Possibly even Waffle can help, I know he's into that history. I'll repost here if I can find any posters from old threads that you could contact.

Howitzer · « **Reply #6 on:** April 01, 2005, 02:12:45 PM »

Just found one... Gscholz... he's very knowledgable in 109s and hangs out in the aircraft/vehicles forum.

Heretik · « **Reply #7 on:** April 01, 2005, 02:15:54 PM »

Howdy Manx!
Messerschmitt 109 - myths, facts and the view from the cockpit Very interesting (if somewhat long) read.

DaddyAck · « **Reply #8 on:** April 01, 2005, 02:22:05 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Morpheus
I can't imagine what a nightmare/ thrill[/I][/COLOR]/joy it was to fly something like the G10.

Man It would have really been an experience, The Bf-109 series was a formidable weapon, I also like the Fw-190 series.

Murdr · « **Reply #9 on:** April 01, 2005, 02:32:42 PM »

Howdy Manx. Are you just dropping by the bbs, or are you going to visit in game too?

Crumpp in the aircraft/vehicles forum would probably have the data you're looking for, or know where to find it. Here Is a site that gives a decent overview of compression (critical mach, airflow diagrams, foil design). Its not about the 109 specifically, but it shows the 'why'.

lol, I steped afk for a few mins, came back and submited post, and like 6 post went up while i wasnt looking.

wetrat · « **Reply #10 on:** April 01, 2005, 02:38:06 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Howitzer
I think what he is asking, is what data did HTC use to model the 109, and in that data is this tendency for compression documented?

I've read numerous times in my LW books the compression speed for 109's... but I don't remember it

It's 600something km/h I believe. 640 perhaps?

FiLtH · « **Reply #11 on:** April 01, 2005, 03:04:13 PM »

Howitzer · « **Reply #12 on:** April 01, 2005, 03:30:55 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by wetrat
I've read numerous times in my LW books the compression speed for 109's... but I don't remember it It's 600something km/h I believe. 640 perhaps?

My conversion is a little hazy, but I almost wonder if the G10 compression in the game is a little under what it should be. Basically because if you use WEP in level flight you'll push 370 or higher (I think), and it seems to compress at around 450... not too much of a difference if you consider diving about 100 ft.

Karnak · « **Reply #13 on:** April 01, 2005, 03:51:26 PM »

IIRC it isn't compression. It is heavy stick forces. You can trim out of it, whereas you cannot trim out of compression.

TheManx · « **Reply #14 on:** April 01, 2005, 04:19:52 PM »

I'm not sure about this, because in the 38 you can trim clear even though you're in compression. Unless it's just stick force as well. Both planes from my memory seem to lose all control once a certain speed is exceeded, and must be brought back through trimming.