Author Topic: Made some nice new acquaintances  (Read 1546 times)

Offline Grendel

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Made some nice new acquaintances
« Reply #30 on: April 15, 2005, 03:56:26 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by jaxxo
Ok after reading the thread again its seems some of you are as confused as I am.Enlighten me please so I dont put my foot in my mouth again.They are fins who flew 109's for the german's correct?


Finns flew for Finland. Our pilots did not fly American planes for USA, Italian built planes for Italy or British built planes for Great Britain. Not even captured Soviet planes for SOviet Union.

Airplanes are a commodity, which can be bought, sold and traded as anything else as well. Each owner uses the planes to whatever purpose needed for their country's needs.

You'll find plenty stuff in here:
http://www.virtualpilots.fi/hist/

And some links for other info:
http://hkkk.fi/~yrjola/war/faf/ww2air.html
http://www.sci.fi/~fta/history.htm
http://www.sci.fi/~ambush/faf/faf.html
http://www.ww2wings.com/wings/finland/finlandmain.shtml
http://peacecountry0.tripod.com/brewster.htm

Offline jaxxo

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« Reply #31 on: April 15, 2005, 05:17:48 PM »
ty grendel....this statement from an article in your link sums it up.....                                                                                                            "the plane is also victim of intentional disinformation, many most persistent urban myths and just ignorance."  Good reading.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2005, 05:22:08 PM by jaxxo »

Offline airbumba

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« Reply #32 on: April 15, 2005, 07:31:09 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by jaxxo
ty grendel....this statement from an article in your link sums it up.....                                                                                                            "the plane is also victim of intentional disinformation, many most persistent urban myths and just ignorance."  Good reading.


Gentlemen of honour, please assist me in reckognizing this thread as one of many that have shown respect for flyers and airmen from various countries that have given the ultimate sacrifice.

gents.
I used to be a fatalist,
but that part of me died.

Offline Panzzer

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« Reply #33 on: April 15, 2005, 09:53:09 PM »
NP, Bumba. :)

<> Gentlemen!
Panzzer - Lentorykmentti 3

Offline Sloehand

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« Reply #34 on: April 15, 2005, 11:57:27 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by jaxxo
Ok after reading the thread again its seems some of you are as confused as I am.Enlighten me please so I dont put my foot in my mouth again.They are fins who flew 109's for the german's correct? I like my history so any web links i would appreciate. I apologize for the stupidity on my part.


My first post so please forgive any lack of style or etiquette.  Jaxxo, prior to WWII Finland lost a short war against Russia, and so aligned with Germany once conflict broke out between the Germans and Russians.  Purely an alignment with the devil to try to recover what was lost in their war with Russia.
In that ealier conflict, initially the Finns kicked Russian butt, but the Russians came back for more and overpowered the much smaller country, exacting territorial losses on Finland as a result.
Jagdgeschwader 77

"You sleep safe in your beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do you harm."  - George Orwell
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Benjamin Franklin

Offline airbumba

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« Reply #35 on: April 16, 2005, 04:09:12 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Panzzer
NP, Bumba. :)

<> Gentlemen!


You da man Panzzer, and thanks again for the map u sent me,. I'm almost done with that painting.
I used to be a fatalist,
but that part of me died.

Offline CHECKERS

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« Reply #36 on: April 16, 2005, 06:26:30 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by jaxxo
are we so infatuated with aviation that we forget these guys were nazis?


  Not all of them..... One of General Yager's "very closest friends is General Gunther Rall ". ( 3rd highest scoring German Fighter Pilot in WW II ) I'm sure General Yager is a good judge of people .....
 You can see General Yager refer to this on the Military Channel , in Target Berlin ........
 
  Also, one of my best Friends Dad,  was forced to either join the SS , or get shot dead ! He joined , after the war he moved here became an American Citizen .

   Take a look at this website.....

      http://www.virtualpilots.fi/feature/photoreports/guntherrall2003/

  Regards
CHECKERS
« Last Edit: April 16, 2005, 06:34:46 AM by CHECKERS »
Originally posted by Panman
God the BK's are some some ugly mo-fo's. Please no more pictures, I'm going blind Bet your mothers don't even love ya cause u'all sooooooooo F******* ulgy.

Offline Grendel

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« Reply #37 on: April 16, 2005, 06:49:09 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sloehand
Jaxxo, prior to WWII Finland lost a short war against Russia, and so aligned with Germany once conflict broke out between the Germans and Russians.  Purely an alignment with the devil to try to recover what was lost in their war with Russia.


Well, this history isn't really the subject of this topic here, but I'd like to clarify in short, that the "alignment" happened before Germany attacked SU. What happened, was that in spring/summer 1940 Germany guaranteed Finnish independency, in a way, against further Soviet aggression. This was a 180 degree reversal on German policy, since Germany was allied to SU during the Winter War. Germany's guarantee prevented "Winter War II", that Soviet Union was preparing for - they were preparing for new war against FInland to begin in autumm/winter 1940.  They were, in a way, already conducting political warfare against Finland and trying to fall Finnish lawful government, preparing ground for new military offensive. This ended when Germany told Molotov "hands off Finland", making cross-deals about food supplies to Finland (the country was dependant on foreign trade to feed the population, and the war had cut all trade routes - there were only two nations that could sell food, Germany and SU) vs raw materials to Germany.

So when Germany then suddenly attacked Soviet Union, it was a huge surprise for Finnish population - but SU had already forced Finland into Germany's side, by their attack in 1939 and continued political offensive in 1940.

If you wish to comment this further, please make own thread for it :) This should be about honoring the vets. :)

Offline GScholz

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« Reply #38 on: April 16, 2005, 08:54:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by jaxxo
are we so infatuated with aviation that we forget these guys were nazis?


Also ... Most of the surviving LW pilots flew for NATO after the war. Rall became a NATO general and Hartmann ended his career as a colonel in the West-German air force. Were some of them Nazis? Sure, most likely, but that’s just a political belief. Above all they were soldiers fighting for their country.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."