Author Topic: No wonder US companies are going under  (Read 1057 times)

Offline Midnight

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1809
      • http://www.brauncomustangs.org
No wonder US companies are going under
« on: July 20, 2005, 03:15:44 PM »
OK, another Big company that is in financial trouble gets some new college educated super geek that decides they need to do the new 6-Sigma (whatever) business practice. In order to do it, they THROW AWAY all kinds of stuff. Some examples...

1. If the tool box had more than one of a particular size wrench (i.e. two 9/16" combo wrenches) then one had to be thrown away in the trash. No employee could take it, it had to go in the trash.
2. If the spare parts inventory had more than one of the same item (i.e. two flange-seal gaskets) then all but one had to be thrown in the trash.

After a while, a valve needed to be replaced on a piece of equipment. To do the job, two 9/16" wrenches are needed to remove the nuts and bolts. Hmm.. can't do the job, only one 9/16" wrench. After finally removing the nuts and bolts and getting the new valve, the repair could not be completed because there was only one flange-seal gasket available and the job required two.

Now a simple repair job that normally took less than an hour to complete took almost 3 days because a new gasket had to be ordered with express delivery. Don't know the total cost of that repair, but with the admin cost (PO and associated paperwork), lost production time, wasted man-hours of operators that would have used the down equipment, etc. I am sure it was a lot higher and less efficient than it would have been to have two wrenches and a couple gaskets in stock.

-----

A company (company 1) that makes large carbon-carbon parts had several large waste containers of scrap (from broken parts, machining errors, etc.) A second company (company 2) could have used the large scrap pieces to make many smaller machined pieces.

Company 1 decided to get rid of the scrap. Company 2 was aware of this and offered to remove the scrap and PAY Company 1 for it as a bulk price for goods recieved. Company 1 said it would be too much paperwork hassle to do the transaction so had the scrap removed by a industrial waste removal company. The waste company charged 5-figures $$$$$ for the service.

------

Last example. A company has a whole factory floor full of usable machinery and processing equipment. Some of it brand new and never even installed. They need to clear the space for consolidation and offered the items for sale. My company offered to buy a large portion of the items.

Some laywer got wind of the pending sale and stopped the whole thing because of fear of liability on the used equipment. We informed them we would sign wivers, etc. for all items, however the laywer refused. Now all of the equipment is going to be cut up to prevent it from being used, and then hauled off as scrap.

Now rather than making some money back for all the equipment, the copany is going to have to pay to have the stuff destroyed and hauled away.

-------

Have American companies become so wrapped up in what college educated clowns tell them that they are so willing to toss away oppurtunity to make money? No wonder they are going out of business all over the place.

Offline Hangtime

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10148
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2005, 03:19:53 PM »
Darwin works in the business world too.
The price of Freedom is the willingness to do sudden battle, anywhere, any time and with utter recklessness...

...at home, or abroad.

Offline Sandman

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 17620
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2005, 03:20:31 PM »
Source?
sand

Offline Siaf__csf

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2213
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2005, 03:25:14 PM »
Looks like that. Any company that is run by accountants will die or at least wither away. If the business leadership doesn't have a clue about the scope of activity and run by numbers, things go bad real quick.

US isn't the only place where the beforementioned insanity is taking place. To the accountant it looks nice because he's maximising the profitability of capital i.e. the smaller stock you keep the more profit per dollar you seem to get via numbers.

So they kill the warehouses without understanding what it will do to the business.

Offline Shamus

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3583
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2005, 03:31:02 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sandman
Source?


LOL..was gonna say,  who are these companies?

shamus
one of the cats

FSO Jagdgeschwader 11

Offline Russian

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2992
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2005, 03:31:49 PM »
Similar to that, I'd see money waste practices in US military that sounds so ridicules it is beyond belief. That’s what happens when someone lost pride in self work (or too much pride, have to leave something behind, Chiefs are excellent example of useless projects) and were brought up by ‘individualism’ instead of ‘teamwork’ such as in Japan education.

Offline Furious

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3243
Re: No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2005, 03:51:06 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Midnight
...Have American companies become so wrapped up in what college educated clowns tell them that they are so willing to toss away oppurtunity to make money? No wonder they are going out of business all over the place.


yeah, them damn colleges and universities are ruining our country.

Offline Dowding

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6867
      • http://www.psys07629.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/272/index.html
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2005, 03:57:37 PM »
Quote
Looks like that. Any company that is run by accountants will die or at least wither away.


Rubbish and particularly ignorant of reality. I'm an accountant in a large multinational manufacturing company and without accountants to apply controls to expenditure and aid strategic decision making whilst maintaining goal congruence most companies will stagnate.

The best general manager I've worked with was an accountant. His attention to detail and resultant understanding of finance meant nothing ever slipped past him. The division went from a 2 million a year loss maker to turning in a 3 million profit within 2 years.

The examples in this thread are ridiculous - in a lean manufacturing environment, every ounce of capital has to give huge returns.

Quote
the accountant it looks nice because he's maximising the profitability of capital i.e. the smaller stock you keep the more profit per dollar you seem to get via numbers.

So they kill the warehouses without understanding what it will do to the business.


Not true. In a JIT (Just in Time) environment you can reduce the non-value adding activities (like excessive stock holding). There's no point in holding large amounts of raw materials when that capital could be doing something else.

If absorption costing is used to value stocks then you'll actualy find managers over producing at the end of a particular period to boost profits.
War! Never been so much fun. War! Never been so much fun! Go to your brother, Kill him with your gun, Leave him lying in his uniform, Dying in the sun.

Offline Gunslinger

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10084
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2005, 04:04:12 PM »
I've seen this.

I worked for a company in Dallas that flat out refused to by used anything.  Everything new that was purchased was done so by a third party ordering source that handled all their shipping and recieving.  The source allways used expensive fed ex overnight even if we didn't need to the parts right away.

in the military for whatever reason there has been a shift from having actual spare parts on hand.  When I worked RADAR we liked having spare cards on hand for hot swaping and trouble shooting.  The OIC heard about this and made us throw all of them away.  About 30K worth of working cards.

Last year we were changing some glass out and we need 5 washers.  These weren't uncommn but we didn't have them on hand as we turned half of our operating stock back into supply.

It took 3 shifts for the order to get filled and us to get our washers and when we did get them they were mismarked and the wrong size.  

We could have had the job done flat out in one shift but instead it took 4 days.  

I can see exactly what the above mentioned scenerio/example is talking about.  

I know a guy that is the ISM for a construction company.  Their storage wharehouse was full and he needed room for about 20 P4 computers that he just got done changing out.  Instead  of selling them on ebay or somthing they just said "throw them away"  He did....right into his garage.  

The company didn't want to take on the "debt" of renting another storage unit $59.99/mo so they took a loss instead.  Some how the accountants justify this:confused:

Offline Midnight

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1809
      • http://www.brauncomustangs.org
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2005, 04:14:35 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Sandman
Source?


Source is first hand experience.. unfortunately

Offline Midnight

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1809
      • http://www.brauncomustangs.org
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2005, 04:18:12 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Dowding
Rubbish and particularly ignorant of reality. I'm an accountant in a large multinational manufacturing company and without accountants to apply controls to expenditure and aid strategic decision making whilst maintaining goal congruence most companies will stagnate.

The best general manager I've worked with was an accountant. His attention to detail and resultant understanding of finance meant nothing ever slipped past him. The division went from a 2 million a year loss maker to turning in a 3 million profit within 2 years.

The examples in this thread are ridiculous - in a lean manufacturing environment, every ounce of capital has to give huge returns.



Not true. In a JIT (Just in Time) environment you can reduce the non-value adding activities (like excessive stock holding). There's no point in holding large amounts of raw materials when that capital could be doing something else.

If absorption costing is used to value stocks then you'll actualy find managers over producing at the end of a particular period to boost profits.


Wow.. where did you get all that over explanitory verbage from? You said a whole lot of suff, yet said nothing of the wasted time and materials I talked about in my examples.

Offline Seraphim

  • Nickel Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 527
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2005, 04:28:47 PM »
This is exactly what my company did. They call it '5S' or 'lean manufacturing'. Since I work in a repair department, we threw away tons of spare parts, they 'congratulated' us, and within a couple of weeks we needed some of the parts we threw away. In fact, this constantly happens.

This happened last week:
Me:'Where's that old camera we had?'
My boss: 'Oh, we threw it away, it just sat on the rack...order another one.'
Me: 'Okay, but it costs $1500, and they want to install it for another $750, plus travel charges.'
My boss: 'Welllll......'
Me: 'So, tell me again, how does 5S save us money?'
My boss: 'well the shop looks better.'


Pretty much a big joke to make the managers & executives 'look' good.....

Offline lasersailor184

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8938
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #12 on: July 20, 2005, 05:32:34 PM »
Quote
yeah, them damn colleges and universities are ruining our country.


Nothing wrong with colleges.

However, I do believe the problem is sending handsomehunkes to them in the first place.

Nothing more dangerous then a retard with a college education.  Sooner or Later however, these graduates of Law school will get what's coming to them.
Punishr - N.D.M. Back in the air.
8.) Lasersailor 73 "Will lead the impending revolution from his keyboard"

Offline Gunslinger

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10084
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #13 on: July 20, 2005, 06:07:39 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by lasersailor184
Nothing wrong with colleges.

However, I do believe the problem is sending handsomehunkes to them in the first place.

Nothing more dangerous then a retard with a college education.  Sooner or Later however, these graduates of Law school will get what's coming to them.





:rofl

kinda like transistors and computers.  Crap in Crap out. ;)

Offline Mustaine

  • Parolee
  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 4139
No wonder US companies are going under
« Reply #14 on: July 20, 2005, 07:15:11 PM »
xerox has been trying to implement lean 6-sigma, with horrendous results


let's just say average wait time for a down copier went from under 4 hours to almost 2 days.
Genetically engineered in a lab, and raised by wolverines -- ]V[ E G A D E T ]-[
AoM DFC ZLA BMF and a bunch of other acronyms.