B-29 Super Fortress

[Saxman]

There are plenty of fighters in this game that can go higher than a B-29 can go and bombers too.

The later-model P-47s for sure, the M would certainly be an ideal 29 interceptor with its heavy armament and high-altitude performance. The P-38s, F4Us, P-51s, Spit XIV and Ta-152 also all have the high-altitude performance to intercept the 29.

[Void]

Put 5 RATOs on the b-29.. make it unrealistic 

[Saxman]

Put 5 RATOs on the b-29.. make it unrealistic 

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Why?

 

[A.F. Crash, Fire, Rescue]

...

Why?

 

So you can at least have a chance of getting airborne off of our current runways.

[trigger2]

Nemisis the B-29 would burn all its fuel before reaching 30k if it has a full bomb load (20k). With a 10k load it can reach 30k and it can even go a little higher but it will not do it quickly. There are plenty of fighters in this game that can go higher than a B-29 can go and bombers too. I fly that high in both roles (fighter and bomber) and I think I understand just how to take out formations.

Uhm... it would burn all its fuel?

B-29: Combat range: 3,250 mi (2,820 nmi, 5,230 km)
B-24: Combat range: 2,100 mi (1,800 nmi, 3,400 km)

B-29: Service ceiling: 33,600 ft (10,200 m)
B-24: Service ceiling: 28,000 ft (8,500 m)


B-29: Speed @ 33k 357 mph (310 knots, 574 km/h)
190A-8: Max speed 656 km/h (407.62 mph) at 4,800 m (15748 ft) with boost.

Hmm, the B-29s speed at 33k is only ~50mph slower than the 190s top speed with boost at its prime alt... 

[Chalenge]

Service ceiling on the B-29 IS NOT 33,600 feet it is  23,960 feet.

Yes it would burn all its fuel before it got to 30k. With a full bomb load of 20000 lbs (40x500 lbs) the service ceiling is something like 10000 feet below its maximum ceiling (when empty). At service ceiling the airplanes climb rate drops to 100 feet per minute and above that altitude the climb speed slowly drops to 0 feet per minute which is why you level at the service ceiling (also because otherwise you just waste fuel). There is nothing worse than plodding along trying to climb above your service ceiling and getting attacked by fighters because you will be hanging there at your climb speed and not at cruise speed.

These airplanes routinely operated at 25,000 feet with the maximum bomb load of forty 500 lb bombs and the last 1000 feet of climb must of been exhausting but many many more of these planes were destroyed by their own engines overheating trying to get there than the enemy ever shot down.

Also the one thing that really reduces the altitude is the amount of fuel the B-29 carries. With a maximum bomb load the fuel load must be reduced to avoid overloading the airframe. This is one airplane that would have to be taken into consideration and the worst thing a noob could ever do is load it with a max bomb load and 100 fuel on an elevated field.

[trigger2]

Service ceiling on the B-29 IS NOT 33,600 feet it is  23,960 feet.

Powerplant:

Four Wright R-3350-23 Duplex Cyclone eighteen-cylinder air-cooled radial engines each with two General Electric turbosuperchargers, delivering 2,200 hp for takeoff and having a war emergency rating of 2,300 hp at 25,000 feet.

Performance:

Maximum speed 357 mph at 30,000 feet, 306 mph at sea level. Maximum continuous cruising speed 342 mph at 30,000 feet. Economical cruising speed 220 mph at 25,000 feet. Initial climb rate 900 feet per minute at combat weight. An altitude of 20,000 feet could be attained in 38 minutes. Service ceiling 33,600 feet. Maximum range was 3250 miles at 25,000 feet with 10,000 pound bomb load. Practical operational radius was 1,600-1,800 miles. Maximum ferry range was 5,600 miles, rising to 6,000 miles with the extra fuel.

Weights:

74,500 pounds empty, normal loaded 120,000 pounds, maximum overload 135,000 pounds.

Dimensions:

Wingspan 141 feet 3 inches, length 99 feet 0 inches, height 27 feet 9 inches, wing area 1,736 square feet.

Armament:

Twelve 0.50-inch machine guns in four remotely-controlled turrets (two above and two below the fuselage) and in the tail, each with 1000 rounds of ammunition. In addition, early production blocks had a single rearward-firing 20-mm M2 Type B cannon with 100 rounds in the tail position. Later, two more guns were provided for the forward top turret. Maximum internal short-range, low-altitude bomb load was 20,000 pounds. A load of 15000 pounds of bombs could be carried over a 1600-mile radius at high altitude. A load of 17,000 pounds of bombs could be carried over a 1600-mile radius at medium altitude.

A few more sources...
http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/usa/bomber/b-29.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B-29_Superfortress (Check out the references at the bottom of the page...)

And my personal favorite...

http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=527

Here's a quote from that last one...

December 1943 U.S. Army Air Forces leadership committed the Superfortress to Asia, where its great range made it particularly suited for the long over-water flights against the Japanese homeland from bases in China.

Hmm... Great range = running out of fuel in ~50 mins? Something seems off here...

 

[Bronk]

A few more sources...
http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/usa/bomber/b-29.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B-29_Superfortress (Check out the references at the bottom of the page...)

And my personal favorite...

http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=527

Here's a quote from that last one...
Hmm... Great range = running out of fuel in ~50 mins? Something seems off here...

 

From your own quote.

Maximum range was 3250 miles at 25,000 feet with 10,000 pound bomb load.



 

[Chalenge]

I am not disputing that it can get that high but I am saying it wont get that high with max fuel and bombs loaded. 20,000 lbs is a lot of weight and my statement is not in conflict with the way things work in AHII. Take a B-24 loaded with just 3/4 fuel and 8,000 lbs and it wont get above 27,000 feet before you give up trying to climb higher even though the plane can go to 35k which is much higher than the B-29 its just a waste of fuel to try to climb higher.

With a 10,000 lb bomb load of course it can go further and higher and yes the engines can be used at lower power settings because of the lighter load. In AHII you wont be using a lower cruise setting though and your fuel will go faster.

[Nemisis]

Perhaps you don't understand what I'm saying. It's literally difficult to maintain altitude at that altitude with the planes you mentioned, let alone fight anything. I don't think the 110 is even capable of reaching 30k.

Yes, I thought you were saying the climb rate sucked so bad, no one would bother climbing that high. But either way, there are a number of heavily armed A/C that can catch the B-29 and shoot it down without undue difficulty.

[Nemisis]

I think I understand just how to take out formations.

I wasn't saying it would be impossible to take out a group of more than 2 bombers. All I was saying is that its not going to be a milk run for the fighters...

[100goon]

guys, this post FAILS, so FAIL, no really, FAIL!!!

[Motherland]

From your own quote.

Maximum range was 3250 miles at 25,000 feet with 10,000 pound bomb load.



 

Let's assume that the range is half that for a full bomb load (which would be ridiculous...)
And then take into account the 2x fuel burn in the MA.

Max range would be 812.5 miles. Which is longer than flying from the lower left to upper right hand corner of a large map.

[Chalenge]

That isnt the point at all. The point is you may well arrive at your target and have plenty of fuel but you most certainly will not be at the maximum ceiling of the B-29 since you have too much fuel onboard AND the heaviest bomb load it can carry. This is very easy to verify by loading a Lancaster with its heaviest load and 25 fuel and then also loading it with 100 fuel and its heaviest load. The 25% loadout will not only get to altitude faster it will get to a higher altitude. Not only do you not have the patience to get to 30k in a heavy Lancaster but it cant get to 30k no matter how much patience you have. Once you drop the bombs its a completely different story.

As far as range is concerned yes the range is severely decreased by loading heavier bombs and the effect of a heavier load is made worse the higher you climb because you use more fuel and cut the range ever and ever more. Fortunately the effect of overworked engines doesnt effect planes in AH or you would never make it period. B-29s had a really bad problem with engine fires when the engines got overheated and there isnt a bomber pilot in the game that uses engines realistically (and why should they?). But in the real B-29 the engine fires would ignite an accessory housing made of magnesium and this would burn so intensely that the spars would burn through and the wings would fail (crewmen had fifty seconds to get the flames out or bailout within ninety seconds).

[Bronk]

That isnt the point at all. The point is you may well arrive at your target and have plenty of fuel but you most certainly will not be at the maximum ceiling of the B-29 since you have too much fuel onboard AND the heaviest bomb load it can carry. This is very easy to verify by loading a Lancaster with its heaviest load and 25 fuel and then also loading it with 100 fuel and its heaviest load. The 25% loadout will not only get to altitude faster it will get to a higher altitude. Not only do you not have the patience to get to 30k in a heavy Lancaster but it cant get to 30k no matter how much patience you have. Once you drop the bombs its a completely different story.

As far as range is concerned yes the range is severely decreased by loading heavier bombs and the effect of a heavier load is made worse the higher you climb because you use more fuel and cut the range ever and ever more. Fortunately the effect of overworked engines doesnt effect planes in AH or you would never make it period. B-29s had a really bad problem with engine fires when the engines got overheated and there isnt a bomber pilot in the game that uses engines realistically (and why should they?). But in the real B-29 the engine fires would ignite an accessory housing made of magnesium and this would burn so intensely that the spars would burn through and the wings would fail (crewmen had fifty seconds to get the flames out or bailout within ninety seconds).

That's what I was getting at. Thanks