A question for 109F4 drivers

[AKFokerFoder+]

I have a question for the 109F4 drivers.

When you are low slow, and rolling in the mud with a bogey, what throttle setting do you use?  I try to avoid low and slow, but every now and then I get a mean streak in me, and I dive down and get in a turn fight with a Yak, or a LA5/7.  Or sometimes some dweeb in a LaLa thinks he can just run you down and you will fly nice and straight from his uber ride.  Killing Spit Vs is fun too.  

But low and slow too long and the cherry pickers (like me) boom ya LOL

I have been using about ¾ throttle, but I think a manifold pressure would be a better judge of where to set the throttle.  Of course at times turning a turn fight, when I go vertical, I may even turn on WEP for a few seconds.

Flaps are a nice touch when speed is appropriate also.

Any tips?  Like do you use hard left or hard right trim on your rudder?  Etc.

It always amazes me how may people figure you can’t turn because you are in a 109

Thanks  

[Krusty]

Well, not being an expert, take this with a grain of salt --

I never check the throttle. It's more of a sound/feel thing. Some folks turn the engine sound down in settings, but I don't. I like to hear the engine, as it gives me an approx of the throttle/rpm settings. Also keys me in to 'charger changes at alt while trying to retain cruise settings (set to one thing, climb, and your MAP might just start going up again as the gears change).

For 109F-4 and low level fights and scissors, I usually end up full throttle *most* of the time, with WEP some of the time, but I don't rely on WEP as much as some do. I try to fly without WEP as much as possible unless the ride is a total POS. What I'll do is chop throttle for turns and snap it back to full coming out of the turn or climbing. WEP in first stages of vertical, if I can hit the key in time, but then cut it off if I'm going over the top slow, as it can cause spins/odd angle stalls. I'll try more of a throttle chop and cross-control move to force overshoots in slow scissors, rather than just throttling back. If I'm trying to do a rolling scissors I'll leave it on full because I'm using my nose up to keep my speed down, and I need all the power I can get to get just a bit more alt than the enemy with each rolling scissor.

Like I said take it with a grain of salt. Make up yer own mind

[Kweassa]

This is just an empirical thing, but in my case, using throttle-RPM linked controls seem to help me quite a bit, compared to the individual controls. What I mean by this is, if I advance the throttle to max, my RPM control also corresponds and maxes out. If I pull the throttle back to idle, so does the RPM.

 Since most of the German planes flew with such a system in real life, I guess it won't hurt to manage the RPM and throttle the way it was supposed to.


 For one thing, matching the cruise/military power settings with the E6B is a lot easier. Pyro has got the settings hooked up pretty good. When you link the controls, on the Fw190 for example, if you pull the manifold to "x.xx ata" as specifed for a certain power setting, the RPM also matches the numbers specified on the E6B exactly.

 Also, while just a "feeling", when flying this way I find the 190s and 109s responding more smoothly throughout abrupt throttle changes during combat. When I flew with individual settings, and pulled the throttle back to go into maneuvers, the 109 seemed to be a bit more unstable. But after I've been using them linked, it seems to maneuver a bit better.

[Krusty]

any idea why? Torque, perhaps?

[Wilbus]

Should be torque, interesting post Kweassa, will go and try it right away.

[Krusty]

Only problem with that, Kweassa, is you can only do it if you *only* fly the 109.

It might screw up cruise settings on other planes

If it worked on all planes the same I might do the same, but I haven't tinkered with it much.

[AKFokerFoder+]

Originally posted by Kweassa
This is just an empirical thing, but in my case, using throttle-RPM linked controls seem to help me quite a bit, compared to the individual controls. .

'
''
How do you link the controls?

[Kweassa]

Simply, go to the controls setup menu, and select for the RPM the same axis you use for the throttle. IIRC, in my case, at firs the RPM was reverse to the throttle, so I had to check the "reverse axis" box.

[Krusty]

Linking RPM to Throttle

Kweassa, you got me wondering, so I set it up like you said and checked out the 109. While the 109f4 is spot on (and I suspect the other 109s as well), other aircraft are not.

Here's what I found:

In MANY planes (dare I say "most"?) the first reduced setting (i.e. not wep, not full throttle, the one below that) is almost spot on, but the second reduced setting (the one below that, most often max cruise) is usually off by a few hundred RPM (my method was to set MAP and check RPM). In most, the max cruise setting was way off. I checked one ride (it was either the p47N or the 190a5) the max cruise setting should have been at 2250rpm, but it was at 1850. Big difference.

In some planes it just doesn't work, as in the a6m5 mil power is (fuzzy memory alert!) 2700rpm and 40MAP, and cruise was 2700rpm and 35MAP (so that wouldn't work properly if you linked them). The max cruise was somewhat close but not exact.

Bombers aren't exact either.

Thing is, however, that it's close on lots, so if you fudge it and get near the fuel saver settings the E6B suggests, you should still save a lot of gas over "FFT". I'm currently going to use it for a while and see how it affects my flying. So far I'm interested in what it can do for me.

So basically if you want to link your RPM to throttle know that you may be sacrificing some fuel economy and performance when you are not at full throttle.

SECONDARY NOTE: You MUST (repeat MUST) map RPM1 through RPM4 all to the throttle, go into settings on the stick and invert the axis on each RPM listed. Doing RPM1 works fine for fighters, but if you launch a 2 engine fighter/bomber or 4 engine bomber you're boned.

While ShiftE selects all engines for 1 throttle, it doesn't seem to like using 1 rpm for all engines.

[Cobra412]

I've got some vids of me and the JBs fighting. I tend to walk the throttle off and on through out the whole fight. It's never at one setting and I don't have a minimum setting that I don't go over either.

The F4 is actually pretty graceful at very low speeds. I don't have anywhere to host my vid or I'd post it here.

[Kweassa]

Krusty, the numbers match for only the planes which had throttle-RPM interlinked system in real life. The numbers match for the 109s, 190s, and the Ta152 - which in real life, used only one lever to manage throttle, RPM, and mixture all together.

 Other planes do not match well, since most of them planes had separate throttle/RPM settings each.

[Tilt]

I have mapped  RPM 1 -4 with Throttle for some time (AH1)

Its advantage is that it sets good overall fuel conservation (in game) by reducing throttle and rpm proportionately without having to fiddle about

If you fly short range ac this is an advantage......

The primary dissadvantage is in actual combat if you wish to scrub e to tighten a manouver............

In AH fighters exhibit max drag at zero throttle and max rpm..... so the guy throttling back to  brake turn or drop his nose over the top does so more effectievly if his rpm is NOT mapped to the throttle.

Also the deceleration on landing is less for co mapped rpm/throttle.

The "cheat" is to cut your engine leaving your throttle set to max revs. But even this does not work on ac where HT has modelled feathered props.


It would be neat if the rpm was always mapped when in "combat mode" but separately controllable in manual trim mode where it may be (as Krusty observes) set with even more fidelity.

[Krusty]

Kweassa, in AH2 the 190 and the 152 are not accurate. Only the 109. Check it out. The RPM don't match the manifold settings listed on the E6B.

Tilt: I didn't know that.. I was wondering why I was coming in so dang hot for landings the other night!!! Guess I'll have to start the landing process further out. God forbid I lose a rudder and can't use it as an airbrake!

[Knegel]

Hi,

"I have mapped RPM 1 -4 with Throttle..............."

I still dont know how to do this. Was trying to find the way to set this up, but did stumple somehow.

Could someone please describe the exact procedure??

Thanks in advance!!

Knegel

[Krusty]

Sure! Go to setup > Controls > Joystick

There you choose "Select stick" or "select joystick". It lists the axis for all your stuff (I just have a MS Sidewinder). It's got a list of functions on the left side and a list of axis on the right side. Now by default some of the functions are mapped to "None". So select "RPM 1" from the list on the left and then in the right side highlight "Throttle" and then click "Apply". Then find each "RPM 2" "RPM 3" and "RPM 4" and assign them all to the same thing ("Throttle").

Once you're done with each, hit apply before going to the next (just to be safe). Then hit OKAY to exit that screen. Still under the "Joystick" menu is "Settings". This is the screen with the sliders for all of your joystick axis inputs. Click the drop down box and select RPM 1. Check off "Invert axis". Find each RPM listed and check the box on every one.

Hit apply/okay/whatever, hit Back > Back > Back >Back (however many times it takes) take a plane out and test it out.