Making kills/doing damage from 800yrds to 1k - film

[mechanic]

http://www.freeroleentertainment.com/film209.ahf

here is an example of long range gunnery, from around 1000yrds taking off the enemies right flap, whilst taking mg fire from the rear gun of the 110. and then, as the target flees, a concetrated burst into the canopy to pop the melon.


it is not imppossible in AH2 even if they say it is in real life.

slow the film down and watch a zoomed in external of the target to see the hits.

comments please.


edit: yet more evidence. please watch this very short film and check the screen shots.

long range concentrated fire: http://www.freeroleentertainment.com/longrange1.wmv

[Krusty]

Originally posted by mechanic
http://www.freeroleentertainment.com/film209.ahf

here is an example of long range gunnery, from around 1000yrds taking off the enemies right flap, whilst taking mg fire from the rear gun of the 110. and then, as the target flees, a concetrated burst into the canopy to pop the melon.


it is not imppossible in AH2 even if they say it is in real life.

I don't know if there's much controversy on the matter, but "for the most part" it's BS in AH. Having said that, it *IS* possible. Most times its very rare, but in a plane with long range guns the bullets will go that far (50cals count) and in a gun with nose-mounted guns the convergence is minimal enough.

So a plane with nose mounted, long range, guns, should be able to. Probably only if the convergence is set to max. So a plane like the 110G has nose guns, but they're limited due to dispersion and drop, so they almost certainly won't go out that far. A plane like the P38, or the A20G (with 50cals in the nose) has a good chance, and because there is a grouping of guns in the nose, there's also a chance that the bullets will all land together and do damage.

I still think it's BS, but it's explainable BS.

EDIT: At 900+ all you can hope for is minor damage. However under 800 is still "in the lethal zone). I don't rest easy if there is an enemy on me inside that range. 1K is "safe enough" not to be shot down 99% of the time, but like your kill shot shows, under 800 is still the "kill zone".

[mechanic]

Originally posted by Krusty
I don't know if there's much controversy on the matter, but "for the most part" it's BS in AH. Having said that, it *IS* possible. Most times its very rare, but in a plane with long range guns the bullets will go that far (50cals count) and in a gun with nose-mounted guns the convergence is minimal enough.

So a plane with nose mounted, long range, guns, should be able to. Probably only if the convergence is set to max. So a plane like the 110G has nose guns, but they're limited due to dispersion and drop, so they almost certainly won't go out that far. A plane like the P38, or the A20G (with 50cals in the nose) has a good chance, and because there is a grouping of guns in the nose, there's also a chance that the bullets will all land together and do damage.

I still think it's BS, but it's explainable BS.

EDIT: At 900+ all you can hope for is minor damage. However under 800 is still "in the lethal zone). I don't rest easy if there is an enemy on me inside that range. 1K is "safe enough" not to be shot down 99% of the time, but like your kill shot shows, under 800 is still the "kill zone".

hoestly man, you're really not thinking or observing this correctly, you're giving what seems like an automated point of view.


watch the slow-motion clip prepared and linked for ya, and notice the huge amount of concentrated fire firstly on the flap (which falls off in the end) from a range of around 900 yrds, and then the pilot and canopy (110 has a huge canopy) from a range of around 750 yrds which, quitre rightly, shreds the crew to pieces. ie, plane explodes.

it really is not that BS or bad modling at all.

you cant always bracket freak incedents into the same old 'moot points' catagory, but this is not exactly a few random pings hitting you in the top of the head, this is total shreding.

is not Aceshigh2 a simulation of the real world? then is it not possible that luck, and other freak happenings will be just as apparent in the game as in life?


you talk about a 110 'dropping far before that range'. its true. but knowing that the rounds drop surely the next conclusion is to aim higher the further away the target is....


but what if the target you are aiming for is flying almost level at a stable speed and angle, and you are diving down and 'lobbing' hails of 20mm shells from 800yrds? gravity is working for you then, and you dont need many hits to kill a pilot from any range under 800yrds.

when you strafe the town or a GV in a 110, you open fire from 1k to 800 yrds right?   i dont go closer than 800yrds to a PT boat to kill it because gravity is making my bullets/rounds travel true over longer range.

its not all boxed up by rules and stats tables and history books guys, we know and learn more about our subject collectively than any other group of 1000s of people i would wager.


this is to show the new guys that they can do whatever they like to kill, if you think you can make a shot dont let anyone stop you trying.





this isnt about saying my aim is sooo good, its not, i always miss from 400yrds let alone 800 but it is a point that is jaded by views of deep pessimism and simulation world phobias.

[Krusty]

Originally posted by mechanic
this isnt about saying my aim is sooo good, its not, i always miss from 400yrds let alone 800 but it is a point that is jaded by views of deep pessimism and simulation world phobias.

Ahh, in that case, I thoroughly support your comments!

[Morpheus]

Nothing outstanding here Batfink. Take the plane you are in, a P38 with the nose mounted guns, and then you are firing at a 110 which is a very large target and your bound to get hits.

I've scored many hits from over 1k out with planes not just flying lvl. Not to mention how easy it can be to hit a bomber from over 1k in a P38.

Also these arent cannon balls you're firing. They're very high energy, high velocity, 50 caliber rounds, with 1 20mm mixxed in which is also a hard hitting high velocity round in comparison with the other 20mm rounds of its day.

[Eagler]

anything geater than 500 shouldn't damage a plane to the point of a kill

how many actually shoot downs happened at a d over 1500 ft in rl?
I would not think that many .. just another "easy button" for the masses

[Morpheus]

Havent done your reading Eagler. And No one here is talking about 1.5k+.

[Eagler]

I not either as I am talking feet

500 yards = 1500 ft

the whole metric thing is confusing to this dumb yank

[mechanic]

obviously no one watching the prepared slow motion clip

at 750yrds a 50cal to your head will kill you, so will 5 or 6 50cal rounds at once.


this is acurate modeling in action as it shows no damge for the massive other hits obviously visiable.



Morph, i know its nothing special, thats why i'm claiming that it is not 'bad modeling' it is infact good modeling. it is not a BS way to be killed, it is a pure fluke chance taken and scored.

pilot kill = death and blowing up even at 800yrds.


its good modeling.




I'm really adament about this point.

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by mechanic



watch the slow-motion clip prepared and linked for ya, and notice the huge amount of concentrated fire firstly on the flap (which falls off in the end) from a range of around 900 yrds, and then the pilot and canopy (110 has a huge canopy) from a range of around 750 yrds which, quitre rightly, shreds the crew to pieces. ie, plane explodes.
 

Of course the the rounds are going to be concentrated, you're using a P-38 with the nose mounted guns so convergence is not an issue.  Had you been in a plane with wing mounted guns, I highly doubt you'd see the concentration of hits grouped as you see in those screenshots.  Even beyond 800 yards the fire is still concentrated enough that you can do damage.  There have been a lot of times I've gotten off shots at that range at fleeing planes to see the plane start flipping after taking off the stabilizers.



ack-ack

[AutoPilot]

at 750yrds a 50cal to your head will kill you,

a 50 cal round too the head at 2000 yards will kill you in real life.
possibly even farther out than 2000 yards.

[mechanic]

OK another very quick streaming update.

watch a 262 get plastered by wing mounted 50cals at long range and stupid speeds.


http://www.freeroleentertainment.com/longrange2b.wmv (fast streaming)





The first pings range exactly 736yrds as the sprite flashes and the icon reads 800. The exact speed of the 262 at the ping is 458mph.

to me this would suggest 3 things.

firstly, that the rounds that hit the 262 were probably fired at around a range of 900yrds.

secondly, the damage to the jet would be minial unless a lucky pilot hit is scored. almost on about 2 feet to the left.

finaly that closing speeds of the aircraft will greatly increase the range you can open fire at, if you prepare the shot well. this one is obvious, everyone should know that.



The second hits that do grievous damage are at the exact range 587yrds as the sprite flashes. the speed of the jet is now 371mph.

these rounds were most likely released at around 700 yrds with a large lead.



i think we should document and rationalize long range gunnery not dweeb it because its not what the red baron says.

[Happy1]

Yep, I agree, took a P38L last PM, tracked E/A, fired at 1000 & hit the target, an 'unsuspecting target' I might add    It can be done.

Cheers,

Happy1  

[Kazaa]

Great Shooting , Was TrueKill pissed or what !

P38 with Crow mounted guns 4. 50cal 1. cannon aka watermelon loads of guns & super pimping converg, big bellybutton 110 aka easy to hit, Height aka less friction for the bullets, 110 was not moving too much, aka sitting target, 1 great gunner pricless )))))))))))))

All that adds up to your great shooting, could never of been down if anything was changed, but that was still somthing !

[straffo]

Lesson learned : it's not safe to have a P38 at 800yards on your tail.

But it's not new.

From soda :
http://members.shaw.ca/soda_p/P38L.htm

In something like a P-47, the margin of dive safety may be more than 150mph.  Never allow the P-38 to get any sort of shot on you within D800 though as they will all tend to spray the sky full of bullets, one or two of which may hit you and cause some sort of damage. If you are flying a premium turner, then you can also turn-fight the P-38 in most cases.  

I think this page is something like 3 year old !

http://members.shaw.ca/soda_p/P38G.htm

Don’t get caught thinking you can beat one in a vertical zoom, he is just as likely to hit you at D800 with his easily aimed nose guns.

[/B]

hmmm ... I see a pattern