Author Topic: A discussion on troop porking  (Read 1992 times)

Offline MadSquirrel

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #45 on: October 28, 2005, 06:27:45 PM »
You can park or put all that ack you want next to the Troops and one Bf110 or La-7 will kill them every time.  You see a con inbound to pork.  Some say, well up and shoot them down.  Go ahead and try to catch an La-7 coming in from 15K at 500+ knots.  Ain't happening.  Not till he is extending after killing your ability to capture.

I have often seen an organized assault on a base run up against an well-organized defense.  Then one lone porker will fly out and pork troops two sectors back in one pass.  See it happening all the time.  I fly out and take out troops too.  It is a very sound tactic.  However I feel it is wrong to be able to do it.

One solution is to do the same thing to the troops that they did to the fuel.  Normally you have 10 troops available.  If they get porked, make the number available 5 so it will take two loads to capture, or even 4 so it will take 3 loads.  Even in the BKs "Real War" after a base is attacked not every living thing is killed.  Troops are still there.  Just not as many.  Fuel is never completely destroyed, troops and supplies shouldn't be either.


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Offline PK1Mw

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Umm No
« Reply #46 on: October 28, 2005, 06:29:20 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Baine
To kick off the discussion, I will offer this suggestion:
Why not make it harder, to pork troops, but also make it more difficult to capture bases?
My suggestion: Make porking troops as difficult as shutting down fighters or bombers, but require two planeloads of troops to capture a field.
That will relieve the frustration factor, plus add to one of the fun factors of the game _ trying to sneak a goon into a heavily defended field.
It would seem to me that this would a) make the game less annoying while b) also adding to the things that both attackers and defenders enjoy (capturing bases and shooting down poor, unarmed goons).
my two cents


We are spending waaaaaaaaay too much time on maps as it is. What you are asking would make it even longer. So lets just leave it the way it is huh? :)

Offline icemaw

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #47 on: October 28, 2005, 06:52:05 PM »
Every notice how just about any gameplay thread turns into a furball vrs strat vrs buff vrs etc thread hijacked by the same people over and over again Blah bu blah bu blah bu blah.

One sticks their head in sniffs the air then more show up  the next thing you know its Blah bu blah bu blah bu blah.
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Offline Flit

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #48 on: October 28, 2005, 06:56:54 PM »
Of course, HT could always lower the time that troops are down.I think that they are currently down for 40/45 min(if I'm wrong, someone please correct me).
 Maybe back that up to 20 or 30 min and see how it works out.

Offline rod367th

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #49 on: October 28, 2005, 07:55:51 PM »
I believe he has point. Just like HTC changed VH bases to be 3 vh's instead of 1.   Troops should be atleast 3k  each to destory. should be harder to kill troops than it is to kill lone hanger. towns were increased in size and made harder to tell if down.  But troops are easier to kill at a big airfield   than they are at a vh bases. If troops not harden  then install man acks at troops or 5 inch man aa gunns near troops. This way lone 190 coming in to pork troops a guy can hop in gunn  defend troops. Now 190 comes noe pops as base flashes kills troops before plane s get off tunway................



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Offline WMLute

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #50 on: October 28, 2005, 08:03:21 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Baine
I do have a problem with one plane being able to do it at multiple bases.


what about one player being able to take 20-30min and resupply those same bases.

better make the resuplly harder while we are at it.
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Offline Gato

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #51 on: October 28, 2005, 08:34:52 PM »
Slapshot, I think you missed the point I was making.  As always, some people think taking a sentence or two out of an entire thought will stand alone.  If you only looked at the Bold " ", then it all ties together nice.  But that was not the point.  If you would have included the previous sentences on both our statements, they support each other.  But good try anyway.

I agree to the thought that even if troops are porked, there would still be troops on the base.  If there weren't, the "unmanned" ack would not work either.  So let it take more trips in a goon/M3 to take a base.  Or like I said before, have the C47's fly in formation.  There is still the chance they will get shot down.

Lute, if you look at one plane porking troop vis the time to resupply those same bases, it takes a lot longer.  I know I have worked for 6 hours doing nothing but resupply on 3 bases.  Every time I could get them back up, someone would pork them and run off to another base.:O

Offline DREDIOCK

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #52 on: October 28, 2005, 09:09:13 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Gato
I agree to the thought that even if troops are porked, there would still be troops on the base.  If there weren't, the "unmanned" ack would not work either.  So let it take more trips in a goon/M3 to take a base.  


Yes but those troops are for feild defence. Not offencive actions as well as for general feild operations. repair and Maintaiing of aircraft loading ordinance cleaning the latrines etc.
In order to conduct offencive operations you need troops for both feild defence and general operations AND a surplus to use for offence.

I am against anything that will benifit the hordewarriors be they my country or anyone elses. And making troops harder to destroy does exactly that.

Even destroying Barracks doesnt always worked because I've personally witnessed  on more then one occasion, people dedicated enough to fly in goons (often several at a time) from 2-3 bases back during a hordefest.

Though Im not in love with the idea
I could buy into the "more goons/m3s needed" idea if they doubled with each barracks that was down.
Kill one barracks you need two goons/m3s Kill two barracks you need 4.

A better solution might be IMO to leave it as it is now but  be able to choose what kind of resupply you bring in to a feild instead of just "Feild supplies"

Make the choices be say
Feild supplies - Supplies a little bit of everything as it does now.
the individual supplies

Building material -rebuilds things like VH FH's BH's Tower & makes them come up faster

Ammo - Resupplies ammo & feild ack (Say 1 feild ack per M3)

Fuel - Fuel

Troops- Troops

Have it so when delivering "Feild Suplies" everything re-up as the same rate it currently does with resupply

But when you resupply with specific supplies it should increase the speed at which things re-up 25% faster per M3/Goon then with just "Feild Supplies"

As it stands now. Few people bother to do supply runs because unless you have a chitload of people doing it with you  it takes too many trips and takes too long  to bring anything back up to be worthwhile.

With the way  I am suggesting above 1 or two people can resupply whats needed at the moment on relitively short order.

also might not be a bad idea to increase the perks awarded for resupply so as to sweeten the pot a bit
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Offline jaxxo

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #53 on: October 28, 2005, 10:02:37 PM »
Look, how about you just....

Defend your fields!
 


Whos gonna be interested enuff to stop one fast plane from porking 4 or 5 fields of troops? If 5 guys happened to see a base flashing grabbed 10k and tried to kill him they most likely would fail from him killing at least two set of barracks..heck i remember being bored and seing how many troops i could pork in one sorty with a 262..think i got 5 fields solo in less than 20 minutes. (bks's sent me invite shortly thereafter) i think the reason they are so easy is it's one of the few way to stop the horde initially. As irony would have it the only way to slow the horde is to offer heavy vulchbait to keep the sissy's bsy long enuff for some defenders to arrive from a field 50 miles away where ftrs are still up.

Offline DREDIOCK

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #54 on: October 28, 2005, 10:35:06 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by jaxxo
Look, how about you just....

Defend your fields!
 


so long as they insist on defending their feilds AT their feilds they will never be able to stop an incomming porker.
You gotta get away from your feild and stop them enroute before they reach the feild.

I manage to do it. One can make a pretty good living at it too.

When on a base porking run myself I sometimes get stopped before I can reach the target feild by people looking for people comming in.

It can be done.
Just people are too lazy to do it.
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Offline Baine

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #55 on: October 28, 2005, 10:48:41 PM »
Defending a field against a single suicidal porker under the current system is damn near impossible. It's just too easy to take out troops in a single pass.

I like the idea of troop porking increasing the number of goon runs you must make to capture a base. It's a way of maybe slowing down the horde but not giving one or two suicidal defenders a total, overwhelming club they can easily employ to shutdown a whole offensive.
It also puts some of the responsibility back on the defenders, since while the offensive people should be responsible for defending their bases to prevent porking, the defensive players should also have to defend their bases  - in other words run the gauntlet of fighters to hunt goons - to prevent capture. I can't see why defenders should get a total pass on close field defense merely by crying "horde."
 
The point of AH afterall is to capture enemy fields. I can see where you would not want to make it too easy for a horde to steamroll an entire map, but the current setup is to heavily weighed in the opposite direction, where a small number of players can have an inordinate impact on events. It's time to restore some balance. Maybe that will lead to a letup in map stagnation.

I also like the idea of selectable field supplies, since it does give more incentive to resupply a field. If you want to capture bases you resupply troops, if you want to bomb bases you resupply ordinance, if you want to play in the mud, you resupply vehicles. Then you can enjoy the direct results of your taking the time to make a goon run.

Offline DREDIOCK

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #56 on: October 28, 2005, 11:06:11 PM »
Something else I would be for is if you capture a feild Troops are automatically down and have to be resupplied.
wouldnt mind seeing hotpadding goons done away with either.

What are you suppoesd to be doing? Using the enemies troops to capture and man the next feild you take?
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Offline Ratnick

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #57 on: October 28, 2005, 11:13:05 PM »
(when have you ever seen a troop porker make good his escape?)Yes I escape alot - I also go back and take out dar and acks. Goes back to what Morph said - it's a game not reality. Why does it take just 10 troops to capture a field? Why should I have to blow up a town to take a field? What did the people in the church do that I have to blow them up (unless that's where they hide the really good sheep)? Why aren't the town acks manned? Has there been a real problem capturing bases lately? It seems to me that if there's a demonsterable problem with gameplay that is affecting the community there are variables that can and would be adjusted. I just haven't seen a lack of base captures. My 2 bits - someone kick me now.

Offline MOIL

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #58 on: October 28, 2005, 11:48:30 PM »
"Plus increase both type of AA accuracy and make the AA guns harder to destroy. That keeps vulchers away while allowing the attacked base to mount a viable defense"
I've been saying this since day one. People love to argue the whole "realistic" side of this game and how these planes didn't do this or that. How certain planes fly better, blah,blah,blah:rolleyes:

Point is in WW2 more A/C were downed by AA fire than another fighter!!

In WW2 if an attacking enemy fighter were to dive in on or strafe strat type targets, he was 9 times outta 10 met with heavy AA fire, not a couple of inaccurate "unmanned" computer driven ack guns.
Don't believe me, look it up on the intardnet:aok

Have a nice day

Offline ROC

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A discussion on troop porking
« Reply #59 on: October 29, 2005, 12:15:04 AM »
My whole point revolves around the simple concept of players playing the game.

The maps are setup, and the strats setup, so that if the players work as a team, both offense and defense have a shot at making headway.

The side that will not cooperate will suffer.

There is no way that you can model a more "fair" system as there will always be one element that want's their responsibility to be easier.

Work as a team, defend or don't, but if you don't then bases will be overrun.

If the system was flawed, the maps would never rotate as the war would not be won by anyone.

I personally don't feel that HTs resources need be spent trying to figure out every possible weakness or flaw in the playability of  this game.  The map are in place, the resources are available, and it is up to the Players to Play it to their limits.

For every person that want's the porkage easier, there will be a defender that wants it harder.  This will never change.  At some point you just take what is there, and learn it, and deal with it.  I would prefer that HT spends it's collective resources on completing TOD, inserting more planes, and more maps, then to constantly invest time trying to make a simple concept fair for everyones concern.  It cannot happen.  Every single person has their own unique view on what would be the "best" way.  The simplest way is to accept the reality of the current situation and do the best you can do.  There are lessons here that go far beyond a simple game.

Work together, any thing less is just lip service.
ROC
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