Author Topic: Kills vs. assists? (Read 1601 times)

Iceman24 · « **Reply #15 on:** November 16, 2005, 03:21:49 PM »

which brings me back to my question, is it the guy that sprays and prays and sees about 200 total pings that hit the plane in diff. positions, or is it the guy who takes off the planes tail with 2-3 rounds that gets the kill.... for example... I'm flying along and come across a bad guy, i do a quick acm and fire 5-10 round burst that takes his wing or tail off... now as he is falling to the ground another plane comes in a sprays all over the place, hitting the falling plane but not converged, causing no real damage, but say he lands 200 hits... who gets the kill ?

AKFokerFoder+ · « **Reply #16 on:** November 16, 2005, 03:24:02 PM »

What I seem to have a problem with is shooting the kee rap out of a plane, cannon and machinve gun pings all over the puppy, sometimes parts falling off, and I don't even get an assist.

And every once in a while I get a kill, and have no idea where it came from??? Not a proximity kill, just a kill and no bogey near me. Pretty rare, but it happens once or twice a month.

But the shooting the kee rap out of a bogey and not getting an assist is quite common.

Also, I have shot up a gv, the dude isn't even smoking, some guy lands a rocket or a bomb on him and I get the kill??? Not to often, but it does happen.

All it all, I take it as just part of the game

Iceman24 · « **Reply #17 on:** November 16, 2005, 03:30:45 PM »

AKFoder... I experience the same problems... let me ask you this, are u playing on dialup... I am. I know this isn't supposed to have anything to do with anything, just like it doesn't apply when collisions occur and 1 plane walks away untouched( cough, cough, wink, wink ) Sometimes I'll shoot ppl down, get no message, then go land and the points are there, so many times this has happened, 1 sorty I know i had 2 kills, didn't get credit for either, landed, didn't get a kill message, but had 8 perk points from last sorty...

AKFokerFoder+ · « **Reply #18 on:** November 16, 2005, 04:17:09 PM »

I have a High Speed cable modem with about 95ms or so ping

Athlon 3200+ 1.5GB RAM, 256MB graphics card.

I only have about 17 services running when I start the game.

WinXP Pro

BlauK · « **Reply #19 on:** November 16, 2005, 04:19:55 PM »

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
You hit the pilot causing fatal injuries that would have resulted in the death of the pilot no matter if someone else came along and removed the wing or blew up the plane with a 30mm cannon burst.

How likely do you think it that he would have started rolling after getting wounded? At least I would have exited immediately in such situation... or at latest after rolling 1/2 runway (away from the pistolero). Now he took off and fought for some time in air before getting hit with a 30mm cannon.

Sniffle · « **Reply #20 on:** November 16, 2005, 05:01:45 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by hitech
Belive what you will. But he who does the most damage gets the kill.

HiTech

Sooo not true!

So i see a zero flying around looked like perfect kill. So i go for it (didn't look like he had damage) i had lghey i hit is wing if fell off and he fell to ground and i get assist..

Ack-Ack · « **Reply #21 on:** November 16, 2005, 11:16:02 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by BlauK
Originally posted by Ack-Ack
You hit the pilot causing fatal injuries that would have resulted in the death of the pilot no matter if someone else came along and removed the wing or blew up the plane with a 30mm cannon burst.

How likely do you think it that he would have started rolling after getting wounded? At least I would have exited immediately in such situation... or at latest after rolling 1/2 runway (away from the pistolero). Now he took off and fought for some time in air before getting hit with a 30mm cannon.

Maybe they had auto-take off enabled. The point is, like HiTech pointed out (and since some of you seem to forget, programmed this game) the one that deals the most damage is the one that gets the kill.

Let's use an example that someone used about starting a fire on their target plane and only getting an assist. Sure, they may have started the fire by puncturing the fuel tanks but it wasn't a fatal hit. Now comes this other friendly plane and fires at the damaged target and blows off a wing and gets the kill while the other guy is stuck with an assist. Who did the most damage? The guy that poked a few holes in the fuel tank or the guy that removed the wing?

It isn't about putting the most rounds into the target, it's about putting the rounds were they will do the most damage. If you want to increase your chances of a kill, aim for the vital areas. Put your rounds in the engine area, cockpit/wing root area or the tail. Solid bursts in those areas will almost always grant you the kill and not the guy that comes in and gets off the one burst and takes what would have been your kill. Works for me and I usually never average more than 20-25 assists per tour.

ack-ack

Ack-Ack · « **Reply #22 on:** November 16, 2005, 11:17:32 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sniffle
Sooo not true! So i see a zero flying around looked like perfect kill. So i go for it (didn't look like he had damage) i had lghey i hit is wing if fell off and he fell to ground and i get assist..

He obviously was damaged more severly than you thought before you engaged. Game working as designed.

ack-ack

MrDick · « **Reply #23 on:** November 16, 2005, 11:39:24 PM »

Are 100 bullet hits spread over the plane equivalent to 100 bullet hits in a single spot?

Do localized hits increase the damage counted?

Perhaps the algorithm should count damage up until the point where the aircraft can no longer sustain controlled flight (dead engine is still controlled flight). At this point the kill is awarded to the pilot that inflicted the most damage.

This would certainly eliminate the kills awarded for pinging a plane on the way down.

Of course if the enemy lands successfully there should be no kill.

Anyway, I imagine damage modeling is non-trivial, especially where network latency is a factor.

-MrD

Sniffle · « **Reply #24 on:** November 17, 2005, 12:03:25 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
He obviously was damaged more severly than you thought before you engaged. Game working as designed.

ack-ack

No damage vis

Musta had pw but i know i took wing off nobody near me or the zeke..

Ack-Ack · « **Reply #25 on:** November 17, 2005, 12:12:58 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by MrDick
Are 100 bullet hits spread over the plane equivalent to 100 bullet hits in a single spot?

No. 100 bullets spread all over the place will make a lot of holes that will piss off the ground crew that has to repair them. Might get lucky and have one of those rounds become a "Golden BB" but the odds aren't looking good.

100 rounds in a single spot will however make the pilots life come to an end.

ack-ack

Scootter · « **Reply #26 on:** November 17, 2005, 12:29:36 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Sniffle
Sooo not true! So i see a zero flying around looked like perfect kill. So i go for it (didn't look like he had damage) i had lghey i hit is wing if fell off and he fell to ground and i get assist..

OK lets see.... he wrote the code but you want to argue with him about how it works.

Wow you the man. you know more then the father of the game.

Why cant you guys take it as fact when HT and Co. speak about the game?

Sheese

Bruv119 · « **Reply #27 on:** November 17, 2005, 02:30:41 AM »

It seems to me that the experten shots in the game who only take a few shots and fatally wound a plane get stitched up elevator shots are my favourite.

The guy is dead going down but the trigger mashers think oh god look an easy kill thinking that the guy is still alive break him into several pieces and get credit. This annoys the hell out of me because when i know he is down im looking for my next kill. Yea you can call that hes down on vox but people still do it.

Seems like sometimes its the amount of pings registered so i suggest you make sure you put enough lead in so there is no debating who got the kill.

Bruv
~S~

BigR · « **Reply #28 on:** November 17, 2005, 03:49:32 AM »

I just love blowing the tail off of someone and watching them spiral down to their deaths and then one of my brave comrades swoops down and fires a huge burst into the ALREADY DEAD PLANE, stealing the kill. It has happened 3 times to me THIS WEEK. I know it’s more realistic to have a plane go out of control after getting shot up, but its also incredibly gamey to give a kill to someone that basically shoots an already dead plane. Don’t tell me I need to shoot planes more...If I blow the tail or a wing off someone and they are not in control of their planes, I should get that kill no matter how much damage someone puts into it AFTER the fact. It’s different if someone is previously damaged, I understand that.

BlauK · « **Reply #29 on:** November 17, 2005, 04:22:26 AM »

Well, I dont doubt HiTech's word about how the system is supposed to work, I am only arguing about how it appears so that I could understand what is going around with these kills and assists.

Like I suggested earlier, maybe I wounded the pilot with my hand gun, but did I then take most point out from the pilot? Is it possible that the 30mm round also hit only the pilot and therefore got only the remaining points? Would it not also cause damage to other parts?

Are these "hit points considered" as total of all the possible plane parts and the pilot? Or are each parts considered separately? Does the pilot include so many points that wounding him with a handgun can count as more severe than the hit of 30mm into the plane?

It is fully logical with the current system that a plane can be filled with lots of damage, but it still looks ok and flies ok. Then someone puts in one more bullet and the points are spent, target explodes, last guy gets the assist and the one who put in most damage gets the kill. But how does this same logic work with the handgun vs 30mm example? I simply have hard time trying to figure how such thing is calculated.

I am no accusing anyone of anything, just writing about my own observation, which seems like it could be caused by some bug or by some other external thing. If there is a logical explanation to this, I have no worries... there is nothing to fix. But if there is no good explanation, then maybe there is something that has been previously overlooked and could be fixed.