Author Topic: Didn't like 'Fork tailed Devils.'  (Read 1011 times)

Offline Sled

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Didn't like 'Fork tailed Devils.'
« Reply #15 on: November 20, 2005, 01:19:24 PM »
I have not heard from all of my flights, but I do know the ALT's for three of them.

Black Flight: ordered to attack A50 at 25-30K, actual bombing ALT Unknown.

Green Flight: ordered to attack A63 at 25-30K, actual bombing ALT ~18K.

Red Flight: ordered to attack A62 at 25-30K, actual bombing ALT Unknown.

White Flight: ordered to attack A64 at 25-30K, actual bombing ALT 28K.

Blue Flight: ordered to attack A65 at 25-30K, actual bombing ALT 23K.


If I were to do the mission again, I would order the same ALT.
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Offline Dantoo

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Didn't like 'Fork tailed Devils.'
« Reply #16 on: November 20, 2005, 06:45:09 PM »
"
Quote
B-29 raids in PTO were about the only ones to flew above 30K and even they switched later to more reasonable alts.


"Gen. Thomas Power, Commander of the 314th Bombardment Wing, carried out a fire raid test over Tokyo. Bombs were dropped from 25,000 ft. and burned out a full square mile. He reported to LeMay that he thought by going in at lower altitude with a larger bomb load there would have been much greater destruction.Then came the radical decision by LeMay. The planes would go in at 10,000 ft. He ordered the removal of bomb bay fuel tanks claiming by not going to altitude they would not need the gas. All .50 cal. Guns would be removed, and all ammo. With no guns the gunners did not need to go."

"On March 9, 334 B-29s took off from Guam, arriving in Japan under good weather conditions. The planes were stacked up from 4,900 ft. to 9,200 ft. "

"For three hour the B-29s kept coming. Only a few fighters appeared causing little damage. We lost 14 planes with damage to 42. An official Japanese count reported nearly 84,000 killed, 41,000 injured, and over 250,000 buildings destroyed in this one raid. 16 square miles burned out."

Source of these quotes   Plenty more sources available but my interest was raised in this when the same information was given on the History Channel.  Note:  All these low raids were at night.

If you worry about B17 firepower at high alts then:

 "On January 27, 1945, the B-29 identified as "B-29 A Square 52" scored 14 kills over Tokyo, Japan, as follows: rammed by two fighters, gunners then shot down 12 more fighters, the damaged bomber flew 1,500 miles back to Saipan on three engines, crash landed, all crewmen survived, but the aircraft was written off. This is probably the highest number of air-to-air kills by a single airplane during one mission."

Source
I get really really tired of selective realism disguised as a desire to make bombers easier to kill.

HiTech

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Offline Kurt

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Didn't like 'Fork tailed Devils.'
« Reply #17 on: November 21, 2005, 10:36:02 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by daddog
Swoop had an idea that we might use in some future Squad Operations that I think is a pretty good one. We would set the dot dar to turn on at a certain alt. So say anything above 20k will be on dot dar (specific location). Lots of ways for CM�s to fiddle with this idea, but it would be a sacrifice then for buffs to climb high because their exact location would show up. Again this is just an idea, but one worth mulling over.

I do know the next Squad Ops will not have much in the way of high alt flying. Skernsk has come up with a nice Dunkirk setup. :)


Dunkirk would be fun.

You know, by 1940, the brits had radar coverage out to 75 and 100 miles and 30k feet, the Germans we're boasting that they could see 25 miles to 15k feet (although they had no idea that the brits could see 100ish and thought they were bragging at 25 miles... Thus, even that might have been and exageration...).  Granted they weren't exactly modern scopes with little dots for bad guys... But they were able to roughly identify numbers altitudes directions and speeds.  Similar accuracy to our 'dar bar'...

With that in mind I don't think that it would be unreasonable AT ALL to have some kind of simple radar in effect as you described.
« Last Edit: November 21, 2005, 10:40:09 PM by Kurt »
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Offline ghostdancer

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Didn't like 'Fork tailed Devils.'
« Reply #18 on: November 22, 2005, 04:34:37 PM »
Quote
I have not heard from all of my flights, but I do know the ALT's for three of them.

Black Flight: ordered to attack A50 at 25-30K, actual bombing ALT Unknown.

Green Flight: ordered to attack A63 at 25-30K, actual bombing ALT ~18K.

Red Flight: ordered to attack A62 at 25-30K, actual bombing ALT Unknown.

White Flight: ordered to attack A64 at 25-30K, actual bombing ALT 28K.

Blue Flight: ordered to attack A65 at 25-30K, actual bombing ALT 23K.


If I were to do the mission again, I would order the same ALT.


And I would do things differently so that we formed up while not losing the time necessary to climb to the ordered altitude. Only went lower once I compare thet time passed, distance travelled and figured out we were not going to make the target in time.

Have to go back through my full film (almost 2 hours) to see what I did that lost us so much time in forming up and if anything else I did contribute to the our slow forward progress.
X.O. 29th TFT, "We Move Mountains"
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Offline daddog

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Didn't like 'Fork tailed Devils.'
« Reply #19 on: November 22, 2005, 09:26:15 PM »
Does anyone know if the B17 we have in Aces High is a late war (1945) version or did the same model fly in 1942/3/4?
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Offline skernsk

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« Reply #20 on: November 22, 2005, 09:52:52 PM »
We have a 'G-model'.  I think it was introduced in June of 1943.

Offline Kurt

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Didn't like 'Fork tailed Devils.'
« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2005, 07:08:52 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by daddog
Does anyone know if the B17 we have in Aces High is a late war (1945) version or did the same model fly in 1942/3/4?


Dog,
Based on the layout (Chin Turret etc) I'd say its a B-17G, I believe that was the most produced model, and it was a late war varient but I don't know exactly what year it came on the scene.
--Kurt
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Clowns of Death <Now Defunct>
'A pair of jokers beats a pair of aces'