Author Topic: Russia, Ukraine, Europe and natural gas  (Read 462 times)

Offline Boroda

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Russia, Ukraine, Europe and natural gas
« on: January 04, 2006, 01:28:16 PM »
Just curious - do you know about the problem I mentioned in "subject" field?

You know, I always try to compare local news coverage with foreign media. Like - everyone knows about Beslan but noone knows about Chechen gang capturing a maternity hospital in Budennovsk.

Offline john9001

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« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2006, 01:36:59 PM »
russia turned the gas back on.

Offline Boroda

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« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2006, 01:41:05 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by john9001
russia turned the gas back on.


Didn't they tell why we had to turn it off?

"Devil is in details"...

Offline Yeager

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« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2006, 01:50:25 PM »
I heard that Kazprackitstan was going to attack Belurigistad but then Poroppistan intervened with the support of Kerabablad and saved the day!

ALLAH ACKBAR!!!!!!

Seriosuly, yes...I heard something about Russia and Ukraine and natural gas dispute.  I dont pay much attention to that region any more.  You guys are big boys and will play nice together, I am sure.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2006, 01:53:24 PM by Yeager »
"If someone flips you the bird and you don't know it, does it still count?" - SLIMpkns

Offline 1K3

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« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2006, 01:51:15 PM »
i heard russia wants to charge 400% for nat gas. Ukranians and Euros dont like the 4x price.

Offline eagl

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« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2006, 01:51:34 PM »
The media here reported that there was a dispute over a very large price increase (100% or more I think), but no background on the economics behind the increase.
Everyone I know, goes away, in the end.

Offline Mickey1992

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« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2006, 01:56:38 PM »
I got the impression that Russia wanted to show that the Ukraine is still heavily dependant on the Motherland and that if it continued to go the way of independence more of these price increases and/or supply shortages would be in their future.

But the fact that the gas supply from other Eastern European was cut off as well made no sense.  Unless Russia was trying to act like it was not only beating up on the Ukraine.

Offline Boroda

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« Reply #7 on: January 04, 2006, 02:00:14 PM »
Funny how everything is distorted...

Key points: Ukraine was sponsored by Russia for 14 years, they got gas 5 times cheaper then Europe. Now Gazprom wanted European price from them, minus their pipeline transportation price. It meant that Ukraine gets bankrupt in two weeks.

I still don't understand how they agreed, they formed some joint-stock venture that will sell gas to Ukraine for $95 instead of $230, but Gazprom sells gas to this company for $230. Looks like Euros invested into Ukraine to keep themselves warm, but I'm not sure.

Details tomorrow, sorry ;)

Offline Boroda

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« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2006, 02:03:52 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Mickey1992
I got the impression that Russia wanted to show that the Ukraine is still heavily dependant on the Motherland and that if it continued to go the way of independence more of these price increases and/or supply shortages would be in their future.

But the fact that the gas supply from other Eastern European was cut off as well made no sense.  Unless Russia was trying to act like it was not only beating up on the Ukraine.


Ukraine got gas for $45 while Europe got it for $260 and was quite happy.

Ukraine dind't sign a contract for 2006 before New Year, and on 10AM Jan 1st Russia excluded Ukrainian gas supply from the pipeline, while Ukrainians kept taking gas from the same pipeline, so Europe lost 105 million cubic meters in one day. It was pure stealing, fortunately - now they reached an agreement.

Offline Debonair

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« Reply #9 on: January 04, 2006, 02:09:43 PM »
Thats not how they tell it in Lviv

Offline Estel

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« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2006, 02:24:15 PM »
And when they will become frozen, send them a lot of orange scarfes...

Offline StSanta

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« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2006, 02:57:35 PM »
A 400% increase in price, porbably motivated by political factors rather than financial necessity.

Some EU states (Latvia etc) still pay less than a third of the new price for Ukraine.

European governments are having serious concerns about Russias current and future energy policies and Russia's ability to remain a fair partner, despite Putin's assurance to be just that. It's also widely seen as Russia flexing its muscles and indicating its regional importance - some even see it as the first action taken in an attempt regain its former status as a world superpower.

Stocks in Danish alternative energy companies have seen a boost.

As with Russian things in general - very stubborn and either very brave or very stupid move by Putin. He's a smart dude, though and I gather he has judged the political landscape accurately.

Essentially, he's said "Dudes. We. Got. Power. Don't forget that".

Offline *NDM*JohnnyX

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« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2006, 04:05:32 PM »
Nothing wrong with it either from a global perspective. We do the same thing occasionally, usually with the Navy.

Offline Pei

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« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2006, 05:42:45 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Boroda
Ukraine got gas for $45 while Europe got it for $260 and was quite happy.

Ukraine dind't sign a contract for 2006 before New Year, and on 10AM Jan 1st Russia excluded Ukrainian gas supply from the pipeline, while Ukrainians kept taking gas from the same pipeline, so Europe lost 105 million cubic meters in one day. It was pure stealing, fortunately - now they reached an agreement.


You are failing to mention that Gazprom signed a 5 year contract in 2004 to supply the gas at the discount price. Whether or not that was sensible or not they signed a contract and should stick to it.

Offline weaselsan

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Re: Russia, Ukraine, Europe and natural gas
« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2006, 07:16:57 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Boroda
Just curious - do you know about the problem I mentioned in "subject" field?

You know, I always try to compare local news coverage with foreign media. Like - everyone knows about Beslan but noone knows about Chechen gang capturing a maternity hospital in Budennovsk.


Every MSM (main stream media) outlet in the country is aware of the Chechen terrorists Boroda. And report on their atrosities. Everyone I know are outraged by the murder of innocent people. As far as the Ukraine paying more for natural gas....they'll just build a pipeline to Iran and tell Putin to shove his gas.

If the MSM from time to time doesn't mention news from your neck of the woods, it's probably because we can't pronounce the names.

Budennovsk  Bood-an-nov-chick....Bud-in-nof-ssskk..bead-nnov-skkkkk
« Last Edit: January 04, 2006, 07:31:46 PM by weaselsan »