History of Palestine?

[crowMAW]

Originally posted by weaselsan
1759 Map of Israel, indicating the 12 tribes of Israel.

And the name of the region according to the map?  Looks like...Palnstina.  Hmmm...

[Holden McGroin]

There is a region called Appalachia. People live there.

here's a map


It is not, and never has been, a country.

[weaselsan]

Originally posted by Holden McGroin
There is a region called Appalachia. People live there.

here's a map


It is not, and never has been, a country.

Look what the map says in the upper right hand corner. It does not say Appalachia. It seems you missed my original post Palestine was and is the ancient home of the Jews I noticed you missed the part that says Juda Israel

[Silat]

Originally posted by weaselsan
Very simple...agree that Israel has the right to exist, and stop sending in Morons to kill innocent people with the promise of 72 virgins and a pat on the back from Allah. However, I will post the Hamas doctrine here if you would like to see it. It doesn't bode well for peace in the area.

You would have thought that they got the message after Burak had given in to 99% of everything that Arafat was asking for and all they got was the Intifada. Most of my Liberal friends (Both of them actually) were sure when he was elected that it was "Peace in our time". Until I pointed out that Arafat 1> was corrupt and in it for the money, and 2> was a dead man if he offered peace to the Israelis under any circumstances. I was wrong according to them all the way up to the first rocks being thrown. Then they changed the subject, which brings us to Hamas,

 Im Jewish. I know the history:)
There can be know peace with them in the here and now. They want the total destruction of Israel. Making peace with them is akin to making peace with the Religious Fanatics we are fighting now.

[weaselsan]

Originally posted by straffo
Give California the Palestinian.


Problem solved.

Look what happened when you gave Paris to the Moroccans. Bar- b- q Citroens.

[weaselsan]

Originally posted by Seagoon



The claim of the Palestinians therefore lies in an idea that is religious rather than tribal or nationalistic and is clearly expressed in the charter of Hamas. Namely, that the area itself is an Islamic Waqf, literally land set aside or "consecrated" for Muslims until judgment day. Once an area or inheritance is declared "Waqf" it is irreversible it can never again revert and any attempt to do so is considered intollerable and there is an obligation upon all Muslims to fight to restore a stolen Waqf.


- SEAGOON

Reminds me of the Theme song from the Movie "Exodus" About the creation of the nation of Israel. First line......

"This land is mine....God gave this land to me".

 And the Muslims have veto over this? Islam began in the 7th Century. I believe the Jewish faith is slightly older and have dibs on God given lands.

[Staga]

Mixing religion with politics?

Yeah that has worked well in Afghanistan and in Iran + plenty of other countries.

[weaselsan]

Originally posted by Staga
Mixing religion with politics?

Yeah that has worked well in Afghanistan and in Iran + plenty of other countries.

Move along Staga, there's nothing to see here.

[crowMAW]

Originally posted by DREDIOCK

And can anyone do a translation on what it says in the upper left hand side.

Near as I can tell it says something about sanctity and "Terra" (meaning land I assume) and Palistine.

I could translate if it were larger, but I can't make out all the words.  Terra Sancta means Holy Land.

[Seagoon]

Hi Guys,

Just a quick note, the portions of the map that I can see clearly enough to read say "Holy Land...Palestine... Judah and Israel" - Sorry, my eyesight is going. If someone can transcribe the other words, I can try to give a full translation if necessary.

The reference to the Kingdom of Judah and Israel is the post Solomonic division of the land into the Kingdom of Samaria containing the Ten Northern Tribes and the Kingdom of Judah including Judah and Benjamin (1 Kings 12)

The map itself is a Bible Map, but while it shows the historic land alotments as detailed in Joshua, the boundaries are particularly poorly drawn and geographically speaking its a terrible map. The other interesting thing is that it gives the Old and New Testament names of regions (i.e. Edom is listed as both Edom (OT) and Idumea (NT) ) as well as making the land to the East "Arabia" which is how the NT refers to the desert to the East of Israel.

- SEAGOON

[Thrawn]

Originally posted by Silat
Im Jewish. I know the history:)
There can be know peace with them in the here and now. They want the total destruction of Israel. Making peace with them is akin to making peace with the Religious Fanatics we are fighting now.

Who is this "they" and "them" you are talking about, or you just making sweeping generalisations about the Palestinians?  I saw polling research done by a joint Isreali/Palestinian organization that showed that the majority of both are willing to recognise the right for both nations to exist if it ment peace.

[Seagoon]

Hi Thrawn,

Originally posted by Thrawn
I saw polling research done by a joint Isreali/Palestinian organization that showed that the majority of both are willing to recognise the right for both nations to exist if it ment peace.

I would be interested to see the polling data plus the actual question asked if you can post it.

But in any event, actions speak louder than words. The Israelis have proven their bona fides in desiring peace and coexistance via their willingness to repeatedly  cede land (including the Gaza Strip). Whereas the majority of Palestinians recently elected Hamas, and kicked Fatah out of office. Hamas is a Muslim brotherhood organization which specifically believes that all of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf and cannot be ceded in whole or in part to any infidel state. They are absolutely and irreconcilably opposed to any peace that does not involve the permanent disolution of the Jewish state of Israel. They are Jihadists who have offered no major peacetime political agenda. They believe such plans will only be possible after Palestine has been returned to the Dar-El-Islam.

- SEAGOON

[Thrawn]

Originally posted by Seagoon
Hi Thrawn,

 

I would be interested to see the polling data plus the actual question asked if you can post it.

Here is the orginal poll I saw.

http://www.pcpsr.org/survey/polls/2003/p8ejoint.html

It looks like they have done one since.

http://www.usip.org/newsmedia/releases/2005/shamir_survey.pdf

But in any event, actions speak louder than words. The Israelis have proven their bona fides in desiring peace and coexistance via their willingness to repeatedly  cede land (including the Gaza Strip).

I see your point.  But at the same time the annexed further Palestinian land with thier wall.

Whereas the majority of Palestinians recently elected Hamas, and kicked Fatah out of office. Hamas is a Muslim brotherhood organization which specifically believes that all of Palestine is an Islamic Waqf and cannot be ceded in whole or in part to any infidel state. They are absolutely and irreconcilably opposed to any peace that does not involve the permanent disolution of the Jewish state of Israel. They are Jihadists who have offered no major peacetime political agenda. They believe such plans will only be possible after Palestine has been returned to the Dar-El-Islam.

- SEAGOON

Yeah, dumb move on thier part vis-a-vis Isreal.  But it's my understanding that they switched to Hamas because they believed Hamas would deal with domestic government corruption, not necessarily because of thier policy regarding Isreal.

[nirvana]

I've always laughed when someone called themselves Palestinian, or said something about how they should have their own country.  On the basis that it never even frickin existed is why I laugh.  Thank you for making it even clearer Weasalsan.







Palestinian citizens

[Thrawn]

Right, but you wanted the questions as well, they can be found here...

http://www.pcpsr.org/survey/polls/2003/p8a.html