Author Topic: Commercial Aviation questions  (Read 1182 times)

Offline RAIDER14

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« on: February 06, 2006, 07:57:51 PM »
If you have any questions about Airlines,Aircraft,etc. anything else relateing to commercial aviation post em here

My question is whats the highest altitude a airliner has ever flown at?

Offline Chairboy

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« Reply #1 on: February 06, 2006, 07:59:29 PM »
Probably the Concorde, which flew at around 60,000 feet.
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Offline RAIDER14

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« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2006, 09:35:08 PM »
what ever happend to braniff? That was a great airline

Offline xrtoronto

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« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2006, 09:36:23 PM »
Yup, she's only a dream now


Offline Debonair

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« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2006, 09:46:59 PM »
Did the Soviet SST go higher than the UK/French one?

Offline gear

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« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2006, 09:51:55 PM »
Concorde
The Aérospatiale-BAC Concorde supersonic transport (SST) was one of only two models of supersonic passenger airliners to have seen commercial service. Concorde had a cruise speed of Mach 2.04 and a cruise altitude of 60,000 feet (17,700 metres) with a delta wing configuration and an evolution of the afterburner-equipped engines originally developed for the Avro Vulcan strategic bomber. It is the first civil airliner to be equipped with an analogue fly-by-wire flight control system. Commercial flights, operated by British Airways and Air France, began on January 21, 1976 and ended on October 24, 2003, with the last "retirement" flight on November 26 that year.

But all othe flights are restricted to 29000 by the faa

Offline RAIDER14

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« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2006, 10:08:20 PM »

Offline Dago

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Re: Commercial Aviation questions
« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2006, 10:10:55 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by RAIDER14
If you have any questions about Airlines,Aircraft,etc. anything else relateing to commercial aviation post em here


Why, are you an expert?
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, martini in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming "WOO HOO what a ride!"

Offline Debonair

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« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2006, 10:15:09 PM »
lol, it kicked butt on the highly prized Alma Ata routes

Offline RAIDER14

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Re: Re: Commercial Aviation questions
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2006, 10:15:22 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Dago
Why, are you an expert?


no but I do work at the new Frontiers Of Flight Musuem at Love Field so I hear a lot of stories from war veterans and pilots...

Offline ChickenHawk

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« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2006, 10:32:34 PM »
Ok, I've got something I've been curious about for a while now.  

I was flying from the west coast to the east and about an hour or so before we were to arrive at Baltimore, we hit some vicious turbulence.  It hit with such force that the lady in the bathroom came out as fast as she could and didn't bother to go back to her seat but strapped herself down in the first chair she could find.

Suddenly it felt like we were on a roller coaster.  All the luggage in the overhead bins went airborne and then came slamming down with a great crash.  Over and over, negative g's then wham! wham!  The noise was terrific but every passenger was very very quiet.

My daughter who was sitting beside me lost some of her felt animals on the floor.  I tried with all my strength to pick them up off the floor but it was in vain.  The plane was bouncing so hard that I kept going negative g and then I would slam into my lap, unable to grab them.  I eventually got them off the floor but only during small breaks in the turbulence.  I kept looking around to make sure every one had their seatbelts on because I was convinced that anyone who wasn't strapped in would hit the ceiling.

The worst lasted only about 5 minutes or so and things calmed down after about 20 minutes but it seemed like forever.

Another time coming back from Hawaii, two hours before we hit the coast we had moderate turbulence in zero visibility at night.  It lasted until we landed.  That was almost more unnerving than my roller coaster ride because it lasted so long.

My question is, is what I experienced normal?  I don't fly enough to compare it to much so I was curious if I just had a couple bad flights.  After we landed in Baltimore on the first flight, the crew was talking excitedly so I'm guessing it was a little unusual but I'm not sure.

Anyone else have such a ride?
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Offline RAIDER14

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« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2006, 10:40:25 PM »
Tu-144 wasn't really that big of a hit considering its looks



Offline RAIDER14

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« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2006, 10:46:56 PM »
ChickenHawk what kind of plane were you flying in on those trips?

Turbulence
Many passengers do not understand the effects of turbulence, or that an encounter with turbulence may occur without warning.

What is turbulence?
Turbulence is air movement that normally cannot be seen. It may occur when the sky appears to be clear and can happen unexpectedly. It can be created by any number of different conditions, including atmospheric pressures, jet streams, mountain waves, cold or warm fronts, or thunderstorms.

Different intensities of turbulence
Light turbulence - briefly causes slight, erratic changes in altitude and/or attitude.

Light chop - slight, rapid and somewhat rhythmic bumpiness without noticeable changes in altitude or attitude.

Moderate turbulence - similar to light turbulence, but greater intensity. Changes in altitude/attitude occur. Aircraft remains in control at all times. Variations in indicated air speed.

Moderate chop - similar to light chop, but greater intensity. Rapid bumps or jolts without obvious changes in altitude or attitude.

Severe turbulence - large, abrupt changes in altitude/attitude. Large variation in indicated airspeed. Aircraft may be temporarily out of control.

Extreme turbulence - aircraft is violently tossed about and is impossible to control. May cause structural damage.

The reactions inside aircraft vary from occupants feeling slight strain against their seat belts and unsecured items being slightly displaced, through to occupants being forced violently against seat-belts, and unsecured items being being tossed about. (Imagine what it would be like if you were not wearing a seat belt!)

Clear air turbulence
There are several notable problems with clear air turbulence:

It cannot always be foreseen so there is no warning.
It is usually felt at its mildest in the flight deck and is generally more severe in the aft section.
It can occur when no clouds are visible.
Aircraft radars can't detect it.
It is common at high altitudes, where cruising airline suddenly enter turbulent areas.
Turbulence is the leading cause of in-flight injuries. There are countless reports of occupants who were seriously injured while moving about the passenger cabin when clear air turbulence is encountered.

The causes
Thermals - Heat from the sun makes warm air masses rise and cold ones sink.
Jet streams - Fast, high-altitude air currents shift, disturbing the air nearby.
Mountains - Air passes over mountains and causes turbulence as it flows above the air on the other side.
Wake turbulence - Near the ground a passing plane or helicopter sets up small, chaotic air currents, or
Microbursts - A storm or a passing aircraft stirs up a strong downdraft close to the ground.

Injury prevention
In-flight turbulence is the leading cause of injuries to passengers and crew. Occupants injured during turbulence are usually not wearing seatbelts, ignoring recommendations to keep seatbelts fastened even when the signs are not illuminated. It is recognised that passengers need to move around the cabin to use restroom facilities or to exercise on long flights. However you should keep your seatbelt fastened at all times when seated.

From 1981 through 1997 there were 342 reports of turbulence affecting major air carriers. Three passengers died, two of these fatalities were not wearing their seat belt while the sign was on. 80 suffered serious injuries, 73 of these passengers were also not wearing their seat belts.

Turbulence related incidents
The following are recent jet airliner mishaps from around the world. In each event, at least one passenger/flight attendant was injured during an unexpected turbulence encounter.

During a flight from Singapore to Sydney with 236 passengers and 16 crew, the airplane encountered turbulence over central Australia. The plane hit an "air pocket" which caused it to drop 300 feet. Nine passengers including one pregnant woman and three crew members suffered various neck, back and hip injuries, with one of the passengers requiring surgery. Those who were injured were not wearing seat belts.


During a flight from Japan to Brisbane 16 passengers were injured when a large aircraft encountered turbulence. Passengers had been advised to keep their seatbelts fastened while seated. The pilot in command reported that flight conditions were smooth prior to encountering the turbulence. The weather radar did not indicate adverse weather, so the crew did not turn on the seatbelt signs. A number of the passengers who were not wearing their seatbelts were injured when they were thrown from their seats.


A jet hit air turbulence shortly before it landed at a Hong Kong airport, injuring 47 people, seven of them seriously. "It happened very suddenly and everything was very chaotic," one of the 160 passengers aboard the flight said. "The plane just dropped and I saw things flying all over."

Offline ChickenHawk

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« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2006, 11:18:11 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by RAIDER14
ChickenHawk what kind of plane were you flying in on those trips?


As it was a 737 I wasn’t really in fear for my life as I know their built to withstand such forces.  It was a clear sunny day and it came on quite suddenly when it happened to me.

From you post it seems it's a well documented phenomenon but it doesn't say how common it is.

I'm curious how many frequent flyers or pilots like Toad have been through extreme turbulence before.
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Offline BluKitty

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« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2006, 06:20:13 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by ChickenHawk
It was a clear sunny day and it came on quite suddenly when it happened to me.


Clear days are more windy than hazy days I think.  Short of a storm, a Clear day would worry me more for a turbulant ride than one with a 'hazy' visability.