Author Topic: Aces High uses a flip a coin method for collison (Read 2894 times)

Pooface · « **Reply #30 on:** February 16, 2006, 01:36:15 PM »

yeah i guess you're right iceman. and HT im sorry, im not trying to attack you or your game, because both are great;) im just trying to show my frustration, because i dont see many people die from colliding with me, but i see me 'colliding' with other people a lot. i dunno. i do understand how it works, but well... i dunno.

ty for the response anyway HT, it has cleared it up a little

Iceman24 · « **Reply #31 on:** February 16, 2006, 01:52:47 PM »

pooface, i've been in situations where it looked like I went right through the enemy AC, i look in my 6 view and they are still there and starting to pull an immelman then all of a sudden poof lol. I don't really understand the lag/ram issue all that much as I'm not very computer literate, and don't understand things like your FE and my FE, your screen this my screen that blah blah blah. I just always try and remember that if I'm in an airplane and I run into another plane then obviously something bad will generally happen to my plane lol so I try to avoid em, and if it does happen I try and not get upset... its just like a HO, if you end up in a HO position, 9 times out of ten, it could have been avoided. And I would be willing to bet that is the position most AC are in when they collide as well, it happens in knife fights quite a bit, but I think the majority of the complaints stem from a HO collision during the merge

Pooface · « **Reply #32 on:** February 16, 2006, 01:59:22 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Iceman24
pooface, i've been in situations where it looked like I went right through the enemy AC, i look in my 6 view and they are still there and starting to pull an immelman then all of a sudden poof lol. I don't really understand the lag/ram issue all that much as I'm not very computer literate, and don't understand things like your FE and my FE, your screen this my screen that blah blah blah. I just always try and remember that if I'm in an airplane and I run into another plane then obviously something bad will generally happen to my plane lol so I try to avoid em, and if it does happen I try and not get upset... its just like a HO, if you end up in a HO position, 9 times out of ten, it could have been avoided. And I would be willing to bet that is the position most AC are in when they collide as well, it happens in knife fights quite a bit, but I think the majority of the complaints stem from a HO collision during the merge

yeah its usually on the merge for me, or in rolling scissors. unless the other guy has just clipped me in a place that i cant see, say on the underside of my tail with his wingtip, some of the collisions do seem really odd, but hey

FiLtH · « **Reply #33 on:** February 16, 2006, 03:07:46 PM »

I think who dies last in the crash gets the kill even if you both lose a wing. As far as collisions go...who here can honestly say that when involved in a collision, they thought they were completely in the clear? Not I.

Pooface · « **Reply #34 on:** February 16, 2006, 03:17:07 PM »

if im killed while im flying slow in a furball, fair enough, i left myself open to faster opponents, but i dont really see that it's my fault to be rammed by someone else.

i think the annoying thing about the collision model is NOT the collision model, it is the inexperienced flyers that keep doing it, and when they do, and they collide with someone, it tells them they shot someone down, so they think they are doing something right.

if poor flying skills aren't punished in some way, in this case, dying when they ram someone, it's going to continue. the collision model is fine, but the way it affects things in the MA is a different story.

wow, i think i actually managed to put my thoughts into words properly for the first time in this thread lol. woot!

Tarmac · « **Reply #35 on:** February 16, 2006, 03:17:42 PM »

skuzzy and ht should just write out a reply (hell, copy it from one of the thousand other threads about this) and just paste it every time someone doesn't take the time to actually understand why it works the way it does.

Pooface · « **Reply #36 on:** February 16, 2006, 03:23:22 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Tarmac
skuzzy and ht should just write out a reply (hell, copy it from one of the thousand other threads about this) and just paste it every time someone doesn't take the time to actually understand why it works the way it does.

we understand how it works, but we dont understand why it has to work that way. and i guess its very hard to come with a solution for everyone, i mean, you cant make everyone happy. but at the moment, it is p*ssing quite a large number off.

if it was changed, it wouldnt work any better OK

and if we turn off enemy collisions, HOing will increase. oh god, why cant something ever be simple?????????? lmao:rofl

lol. but i just wish that all the new guys would stop ramming me!!!!!

surely someone understands my point of view?

ridley1 · « **Reply #37 on:** February 16, 2006, 03:31:17 PM »

I just say "dammit"

Not much else ya can do.

Pooface · « **Reply #38 on:** February 16, 2006, 03:33:58 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by ridley1
I just say "dammit"

Not much else ya can do.

i used to do the same. but recently i've been saying dammit so often it is ruining the MA for me. and i haven't changed the way i fly, it IS an increase in people ramming

hammer · « **Reply #39 on:** February 16, 2006, 04:06:16 PM »

Here's a quick "how it works" and, I think you'll see why it has to work that way.

Say two players, A & B, line up nose to nose at time 1 like in the diagram below:

Now, being diehard daredevils, both players go screaming at each other in the proverbial game of chicken. Both planes are screaming towards each other. Player B loses his nerve and, at the very last second, dives underneath

Because of net lag, Player A does not see Player B dive away but decides to end this in a Ram. He doesn't change course, he does nothing to avoid the ram. At the exact same time Player B sees himself diving away on his (Player B's) computer, Player A sees this:

Now, Player A suffered a collision on his front end (read computer) and dies. Player B missed the collision on his front end and so survived. If you changed the way this worked, Player B would die even though he successfully maneuvered away from the collission. That would hardly be fair. Now, it is possible for the same thing to happen with Player B screaming in on Player A from behind. If Player B successfully maneuvers away from a collision on his front end, he survives. If Player A does not maneuver away from the collision, even if he never sees it, he suffers a crash. It's the only way to account for net lag. You maneuver against what you see on your front end. It's the same way someone shoots you when you know his nose is not pointing at you... on his front end, it is and he has registered a kill!

dedalos · « **Reply #40 on:** February 16, 2006, 04:10:46 PM »

Another great explanation. Does it explain why when you get hit from behind while you visually cleary avoided the colision, you get a message that you colided? no

Does it explain why you only lost a gun? no

Does it explain what else you could possibly do to avoid it? no

But hey, you got to post some cool pics

hitech · « **Reply #41 on:** February 16, 2006, 04:13:29 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by ridley1
I just say "dammit"

Not much else ya can do.

When it happens to me, I use the good old surger honey ice tea.

Iceman24 · « **Reply #42 on:** February 16, 2006, 05:10:07 PM »

according to the game what constitutes as "tyring to maneuver away from the ram" Is the game taking into account stick movements or what ? does it look for stick movements right before the ram ? I'm not tryin to be a smart *** just tryin to understand how a computer or line of code can determine the intentions of an aircraft, how does it know that player A is trying to avoid, and how does it know that player B isn't ? Also, does more movement = tryin to avoid the ram more ? for example, 2 planes are headed for the HO, player A simply rolls his plane and goes a hair nose up looking at his monitor he figures thats plenty of room and that his flight path will pass right beside and over player B's plane, player B now pulls a hard break turn at the same time, but somehow player B is a newb and doesn't realize that he turned the wrong way and pulls his turn right into player A causing a collision, both players tried to avoid but it still happened, who rammed who ?

Pooface · « **Reply #43 on:** February 16, 2006, 05:12:51 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by hammer
Here's a quick "how it works" and, I think you'll see why it has to work that way.

Say two players, A & B, line up nose to nose at time 1 like in the diagram below:

Now, being diehard daredevils, both players go screaming at each other in the proverbial game of chicken. Both planes are screaming towards each other. Player B loses his nerve and, at the very last second, dives underneath

Because of net lag, Player A does not see Player B dive away but decides to end this in a Ram. He doesn't change course, he does nothing to avoid the ram. At the exact same time Player B sees himself diving away on his (Player B's) computer, Player A sees this:

Now, Player A suffered a collision on his front end (read computer) and dies. Player B missed the collision on his front end and so survived. If you changed the way this worked, Player B would die even though he successfully maneuvered away from the collission. That would hardly be fair. Now, it is possible for the same thing to happen with Player B screaming in on Player A from behind. If Player B successfully maneuvers away from a collision on his front end, he survives. If Player A does not maneuver away from the collision, even if he never sees it, he suffers a crash. It's the only way to account for net lag. You maneuver against what you see on your front end. It's the same way someone shoots you when you know his nose is not pointing at you... on his front end, it is and he has registered a kill!

ty hammer, very insightful, but, i know the whole front end thing. i have 'collided' with guys that on my front end are at the extremes 100yrs away, and once at 400 yrds. i haven't hit them on my FE, so it must be that they hit me on their front end right?? well then how come im the one that dies, yet he flies on.

and also, the damage that some guys take after colliding is just plain silly. like other people have said before, getting a fuel leak from a collision, and having no other damage is a little ridiculous. there needs to be a fixed amount of damage that a person receives when they collide. getting a fuel leak or a radiator/engine oil out from ramming into several tons of metal, at a combined speed of sometimes 800mph, is, without exception, stupid

BlauK · « **Reply #44 on:** February 16, 2006, 05:27:44 PM »

Pooface,
have you stopped to consider that they may ALSO be shooting at you before you get the collision.

If you do not see any collision and get the message about the collision, it means that the collision occured at the other guys FE. If you got damage in such situation, it is from the other guy's guns.