Author Topic: Slow down....Take a deep breath....dont kill donut...  (Read 2879 times)

Offline Simaril

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Slow down....Take a deep breath....dont kill donut...
« on: March 30, 2006, 11:22:56 AM »
It's pretty clear that the battle lines have been drawn, the opposing rationales have been reviewed, the horse has been beaten into a bloody pulp and sent for conversion into proverbial glue. The "furballers" and the "toolshedders" know where each group stands, and they know what they other "side" thinks. Nothing more to see, nothing more to accomplish.

Except deepening rifts and increased animosity.

Additional threads, whines, or rants will not change things -- and may hurt them. So stop already. Lets each allow everyone else to enjoy the game their way, without trashing each other or placing excreta in each others' breakfast cereals.


Check out the map rotation listed in another thread. Notice that one of the very few maps that only appears once is the Donut. This is not an accident, but a deliberate decision by HT -- and here's why he made it:

Quote
originally posted by Hitech
...if the donut map were to leave, it is because it creates sutch a rift between the different type of players.


Quote came from here

Well, we've proved his concern correct once again. Another appearance in the rotation, another spate of acrimonious threads, attacks, and counterattacks. Even though I personally think the donut balances the interests of all players better than any other map, I dont blame him.

So lets stop yammering and yapping. Cut each other slack, let each go his own way, and find a modus operandi that works. A few thoughts....


Furballers. The bombers have been here, they will continue to be here, and they will continue to drop bombs. They will sometimes kill FHs and they will interfere with the fights you like, because the capture people look at a sector and see the bases instead of the equal DAR bars. Tats how its gunna be, so dont whine. If you want to, do a cap and buff hunt just liek you sometimes like goon hunting.

Buffers. The fighter guys are not likely to care about capturing that base you've been working on for half a day, so yelling louder isnt going to get their attenion. Just go about your business, and if you need fighters -- up them yourselves, or make a fighter sweep mission to interest the guys who are less die hard furballers. As a matter of courtesy to other addicts, try to amke your attacks have some real goal, whether it be to capture or to create a tactical diversion. Dont drop hangars if you dont intend to do anything afterward, and if more needs to be done try to take the trouble to organize it too. (After all, for those who profess to like strategy, it would be idiotic to create an advantage without planning and providing for its exploitation.)



And for all of us: rather than rant, lets be proactive. If we see soemone behaving in an anti-community manner, report it here -- and let the community work.

Take the FT brouhaha as an easy example. In a positive way, the cooperative rooks+knight capture of fighter town bases last rotation was amazing for its unity and commUNITY spirit. On the side of ...ummmm... social sanctions, i would think that posting the folks who actually ran the dysfunctional captures of the FT bases in the first palce would allow the community to exert...negative pressure....that might prevent recurrance. (Need help from the 0600-1200 GMT crew for this, since thats when the stuff seems to happen.)



We've heard it said that insanity is continuing to try the same thing while expecting a different outcome. So, blabbing on the BBS about furballing vs toolshedding, or fighters vs missions, would clearly be insane -- since it never has and never will change anyones mind.

Instead, lets step out of the nuthouse, and take actions that can actually change the environment.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2006, 11:39:03 AM by Simaril »
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Offline DoKGonZo

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« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2006, 11:56:29 AM »
If the community at large wants to have an unwritten accord that FT and TT bases are not to be captured (unless doing so would reset the map and allow odds to stabilize) then I'd have no problem supporting that. I think that if enough veteran folks got on the team channel and told the people about to take a FT base not to do it, they'd turn around. One or two people saying it won't make a difference.

But don't expect me to so quickly forgive those who made deliberate personal attacks on my during the "discussion." Or ever forgive them, for that matter. Vengeance has no half-life.

Offline Simaril

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« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2006, 11:59:02 AM »
Just keep saying Voltaire's prayer.....to be honest, it 's likely already answered, DoK.  ;)
Maturity is knowing that I've been an idiot in the past.
Wisdom is realizing I will be an idiot in the future.
Common sense is trying to not be an idiot right now

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Offline wipass

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« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2006, 11:59:04 AM »
Just add 50 k mountains around fighter town,

wipass

Offline wetrat

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« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2006, 12:03:04 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by wipass
Just add 50 k mountains around fighter town,

wipass
there are already 20k mountains, and anyone bombing/capturing FT bases is doing so FROM an FT base...
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Offline humble

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« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2006, 12:07:51 PM »
so disable ords at FT :)

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Offline Mustaine

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« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2006, 12:20:16 PM »
you know, like Dokgonzo said, vengence can last a long time...

i know of people who attack and capture fightertown bases just to intentionally piss off the furballers.

it works both ways too. furballers upping to stop a chain of bases being taken, spying, whatever.

it all is a vicisous circle.
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Offline mars01

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« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2006, 12:28:43 PM »
All this is well and good, but it is not the Furballers Vs Buffs.   It's furballers Vs Griefers!

As for Donut going away - The day that happens is the day I cancel my account and forget about AH.  Fot HTC to cancel donut would only mean to me that this is no longer a fighter pilot game.  Or at least it would show me that he cared little about the state of the fighter pilot game.  And were that the case this would not be the game for me.

As it is now, I am hoping that CT will be the end all and be all for all the tool shedders in this game.  If that is the case I won't give a rats arse if the MA never gets reset, nary a field won or lost or I never see a bomber again.

With that said, I can't wait for CT to get released.:aok

Offline DoKGonZo

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« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2006, 12:34:42 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by wetrat
there are already 20k mountains, and anyone bombing/capturing FT bases is doing so FROM an FT base...


Yup ... there's no need in FT for bombers or troops or ord or any way from GV's to get from one base to the next.

Offline Squire

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« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2006, 12:53:59 PM »
Perhaps folks are taking "Fighter Town", and "Tank Town" a bit too seriously. I dont recall seeing anywhere that they were ever given that name "officially", or that it was ever intended to be a mini-ma, or mini-da. If they were, HTC would have already disabled base capture there ect. and you would have a TT and FT on every map, which you don't.

Its just another map, the designer put certain bases in there for a fun setup, but it was never intended as many seem to want it to be.

My 2 cents, I dont really care about it (bomb it dont bomb it, whatever), just an observation.
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Offline Delirium

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« Reply #10 on: March 30, 2006, 12:58:18 PM »
Getting rid of donut is a bad idea, it is just a symptom of the disease... the lack of strat targets for the 'arm chair generals' who instead hit fields with overwealming numbers instead.

This problem has been going on for sometime, only now we have squads of 15+ guys griefing. Yes, I said griefing... you don't see furballers affecting the toolshed warriors in ANY way.

I think the only way furballers could 'grief' in return is to kill all ord on the map, everywhere. Frankly, I'd have more fun watching grass grow and to kill something that is available offline.
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Offline Mustaine

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« Reply #11 on: March 30, 2006, 01:00:52 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by wipass
Just add 50 k mountains around fighter town,

wipass
someone seems to be forgetting the original tank town on trinity.

he11 fighter town / tank town didn't even exist before that map.

even on trinity people would up lancs and fly 2 hours just to get over those mountians just to show they could do it, and be "cool" or "stupid" depending on your point of view

then the tankers complained about the bombers. then people started taking fighters to tank town to kill the bombers, easy kills. then the bombers started taking jabo fighters to fight the fighters. then the next map (ozkansas IIRC) had that area with tank AND fighter bases in the middle, but there only early war planes were enabled.

that didn't work because eventually with the arenas resetting it caused problems.


there is no magical answer to "protect" tank or fighter or bomber or dolt or whatever town. it is a community thing.

the real travesty is i bet 80% of the MA playerbase doesn't even read or post or knwo about the bulletin board. in that respect any real headway in "communication" will never happen.
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Offline mars01

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« Reply #12 on: March 30, 2006, 01:00:56 PM »
Well squire, if you logged in and couldn't play your style of game play how would you feel?

If then there were maps that allowed you to play your style of game play everytime you logged in, how would you feel?

If maroons ruined it so even tho the maps that allowed for your style of game play is taken away, how would you feel?

Next time try to look at things from all points of view and you won't sound like a clueless, selfish noob thats only happy cause he can play his way.  Just my $.02
« Last Edit: March 30, 2006, 01:03:53 PM by mars01 »

Offline 96Delta

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« Reply #13 on: March 30, 2006, 01:06:29 PM »
For what its worth, I really don't have much interest in capturing
bases in FT.  I'd much rather run a horde to sweep down on them
and have some fun.  Likewise, killing all the FH's at an FT base
would kind of make that impossible, no? So the same goes for
toolshedding FT.   I ain't a fan of it...unless we need to capture one.

As far as capturing FT bases, I wouldn't consider it unless it was
necessary to affect a map victory -  like a couple of nights ago
when we only needed one more base to win and the one we had
been working was too heavily defended.   One of the most basic
paradigms in warfare is to hit the enemy where he is weakest.  
In the case I cited the FT base met that criteria so we went after it.
Can anyone honestly argue that in that situation ANY base isn't fair
game to achieve victory?

Moreover, I enjoy upping in FT for a quick fight and to farm some
perkies myself.  Making kills is easiest in FT so when you want to
pad your perk points thats the place to go. So, taking FT bases
deprives me of that chance as well as the dedicated furballers.
Thats my take on FT....for what its worth.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2006, 01:09:38 PM by 96Delta »

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Offline SlapShot

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« Reply #14 on: March 30, 2006, 01:21:13 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Squire
Perhaps folks are taking "Fighter Town", and "Tank Town" a bit too seriously. I dont recall seeing anywhere that they were ever given that name "officially", or that it was ever intended to be a mini-ma, or mini-da. If they were, HTC would have already disabled base capture there ect. and you would have a TT and FT on every map, which you don't.

Its just another map, the designer put certain bases in there for a fun setup, but it was never intended as many seem to want it to be.

My 2 cents, I dont really care about it (bomb it dont bomb it, whatever), just an observation.


Your assumptions/conclusions are wrong. It didn't have to be spelled out, altho I do remember reading something from NB when he designed TT and whoever designed FT that the intent was to provide an area that could be used for the specific design purpose.

Neither authors just willy-nilly added those areas ... they were designed with an intent and purpose.
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