Author Topic: New gun thread hehehe (sorry)  (Read 1019 times)

Offline Kats

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« on: October 22, 2000, 02:53:00 AM »
I read the other one and hope that my friends south of the border realize that most Canadians do not support the new laws attested by the fact that most of the Provinces have publicly stated that they will refuse to enforce them.  

I'd like to point out a few FYI's about this issue and would hope that the readers realize that this is not an "us vs. them" issue. We are all on the same team here as citizens of our respective countries.

Don't be a sucker!

The issue of gun control is a tool used by government to show the populace that they are taking measures to fight crime. This is fantasy, and only shows their frustration. It costs money to increase police forces and build more jails. OTOH, gun control makes you look like a hero and you get to charge taxes in the form of registration fees.

Do your homework

The British gun crime statistics are a scam. Gun related crimes in Britain that are pleaded down are not included in the gun crime statistics whereas in  the US they are. This is a huge discrepancy. Furthermore, unsolved crimes in Britain within a certain vicinity are categorized as a single crime by a single person. This further pads the statistics and IMO borders on fraud. The reality is (and I can back this up  with independent research) that gun crimes in  Britain are actually rising with the tighter controls. As a matter of fact, most studies show that armed crimes rise proportionally with the introduction of gun controls.

Think for yourself

Do you really want to let your local government off the hook on the issue of crime control by allowing them to brag about the false security of tighter gun controls? Who are we making the streets safer for by taking guns out of the hands of the law abiding majority?

I applaud the average guy for wanting gun control because he/she feels the world would be safer - I'm on your side for safer streets. I'm only suggesting that your reasoning might be flawed. Again I have to ask, Who are we making the streets safer for by taking guns out of the hands of the law abiding majority?

I think gun laws should be geared towards saftey and storage. This is sorely lacking IMO, yet no one ever talks about this in the media  

[This message has been edited by Kats (edited 10-22-2000).]

funked

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2000, 03:02:00 AM »
<Salute>

Offline StSanta

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« Reply #2 on: October 22, 2000, 04:18:00 AM »
We've been through this before.


Please, don't try to revive a dead horse. It's been flogged and it's rotting.

Pro gun people will say "if ye don't own a gun, yer not a citizen but a subject", "dudes, ya gotta defend yerself against criminals who have guns", "dammo, it is my right", "it lowers violent crimes", "it deters" and anti gunners will say "it adds more violence", "easily accessible guns means much easier access on the black market" etc etc etc ad nauseum.

Just let it die. Yer preaching to the choir anyhow, since 90% of the US Ah crowd are republican pro gunners.

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Offline Kats

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2000, 04:43:00 AM »
Sorry about that Santa, I read the "O club" for the first time yesterday.



[This message has been edited by Kats (edited 10-22-2000).]

Offline StSanta

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2000, 08:23:00 AM »
Heheheh oops forget smilies in post.

I dinnae mean to tell you what to talk about man  .

Just meant to communicate that the subject sort of has been discussed, and that people are now firmly entrenched taking opportunity shots at each other  

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funked

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2000, 08:46:00 AM »
Quick shoot Santa!!!

Offline Maverick

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« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2000, 02:40:00 PM »
Bummer when someone independently hits on the truth huh Santa.  

The horse "might" be dead but the anti's are still claiming it's running at a full gallop and hitting MACH 2 besides!  

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Offline StSanta

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« Reply #7 on: October 22, 2000, 04:24:00 PM »
And, and this is amusing, so are the pro gunners  .

YEEEHAW, hi ho SILVER!

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Offline Dowding

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« Reply #8 on: October 22, 2000, 06:32:00 PM »
Just say no.
War! Never been so much fun. War! Never been so much fun! Go to your brother, Kill him with your gun, Leave him lying in his uniform, Dying in the sun.

Offline Snoopi

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« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2000, 01:58:00 AM »
Kats.. you from wpg/mb/ca ?

!

I agree Kats.. storage is the problem.
Less Columbine or "we wuz partyun and he done killed himsulf" stupidity.

The bill in Canada is a Tax Grab with a crime "reassurance" thrown in.

Regards,
Snoopi

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Offline Ping

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2000, 03:07:00 AM »
 Statistics will always be flawed, warped, or adjusted to suit any argument.
 Do we need gun control laws? Yes.
 Are these new laws on the way sensible? No.
 
 Just another tax grab by a corrupt government. (I consider all canadian government parties corrupt)  I agree that new laws should center on safe storage and use, and send all money to law enforcement instead of government coffers.
 Just a pings thoughts on the matter.
I/JG2 Enemy Coast Ahead


Offline Kats

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2000, 10:07:00 AM »
Hey snoopi, that's where I'm from. Drop me an email.

Ok, more stuff to chew on suckers  

January 16, 2000  London Times:

 
Quote
Killings Rise as 3 Million Illegal Guns Flood Britain

Heheheh, that's more guns in 1 year that used to be sold legally in Britain    On a side note armed crimes rose 10% in 1997 and even worse now. Keep in mind (as I mentioned in the first post) that the British government obscures their data by using conviction data instead of arrest data for their stats. This hid about 150,000 weapon assaults.

So here's the new idea by the British home office. Preventive Detention IE, detention of individuals based on the risks they present, rather than whether they have ever been convicted of an offense. Brilliant  . I never liked the presumption of innocence thingie anyhow hehehehehe (sarcasm btw).

This is what happens when government disarms the populace. Now you have to look for the government to protect you......at any cost.

Last thing to chew on.  Dr. Phillip Cook, an anti gun researcher, reluctantly and independantly confirmed a study by Drs. Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz that showed:

 
Quote
2.5 million or more crimes each year are not completed in the United States because of the possession of a firearm by the intended victim.

Offline Toad

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« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2000, 10:40:00 AM »
Kats,

Just a friendly heads-up.

Nothing drives the anti-gun liberals out of a discussion topic faster than proveable fact.

If you wish to carry on a "give and take" discussion with them, you'll have to stick to pure speculation, wishful thinking and unsubstantiated opinion.

 

If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline easymo

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2000, 01:03:00 PM »
 A word on hand gun safety.
 First of all, let me say I don't like guns. I would like to see all of them dropped into the ocean. But this Pandora box, was opened a very long time ago. They are a reality. Being an American, I have felt that I should have one around for home defense.

  The problem for me, was that I had 3 kids. (grown now). If you lock your firearm away, in a safe. You might as well have saved the money you spent on it. Odd,s are, by the time you dig the thing out.  What ever you needed it for, is over.

 My solution for this problem, was a the 1911 Colt auto. I found that my children could not work the slide, due to the stiffness of the return spring. By the time they were big enough to work it, They had been well trained in gun safety. I would test this with them from time to time. By handing them a very, very carefully unloaded weapon, and having them try to work the slide back. When they reached an age where they could do it (about 12 years old) They received a lecture, that lasted about a week, on gun safety.

 I dismissed the choice of revolvers out of hand. Most don't have a safety of any kind. and are point and shoot affairs.
 Another advantage of the .45 cal. APC. Is that it is a fat, slow moving, slug. Its not going to go through 3 walls and, kill the guy next doors cat, like a magnum might. Yet it is a proven cartridge, having been used successfully, in combat, thousands of times over decades.

 There is no perfect solution, of course. But, a loaded, unchambered, .45 is the best one I could come up with.

Offline Dowding

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New gun thread hehehe (sorry)
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2000, 01:03:00 PM »
 
Quote
If you wish to carry on a "give and take" discussion with them, you'll have to stick to pure speculation, wishful thinking and unsubstantiated opinion.

Whereas Toad has no appreciation of statistical inaccuracy, and if he finds a snippet of information on the net, the figures therein are irrefutable and are the absolute truth about the issue at hand (if it 'proves' his point).

He's also infallible and will always form an opinion based on facts - a good example is the 'Kosovo II' topic.

 
War! Never been so much fun. War! Never been so much fun! Go to your brother, Kill him with your gun, Leave him lying in his uniform, Dying in the sun.