Myths of the 262

[Phtom]

I don't fly the 262 much..always break the wings off lol.  But I remember recently someone in the MA telling me how great of a bird it was..I agreed.  I did point out though that it had little effect in the war because it had trouble landing, staying airworthy after a few sorties, and that by the time it was really used the Germans did not have the parts readily available to keep them up.  The guy disagreed saying that it did all kinds of damage.  Found this write up on Warbird Alley:

"There were 1,433 Me 262s built, with nearly 500 more destroyed by bombing raids before they were completed. Of that total, fewer than 300 were actually used in combat.
In its brightest moments, when it was used as intended, the Me 262 was the equivalent of sending the "Three Musketeers" against Sitting Bull at Little Big Horn. In one battle, for instance, 37 of the 262s were scrambled against an Allied raid that consisted of 1,221 bombers and 632 fighter escorts! In their most effective performance, they cost the Allies a one percent loss."

We might as well get the Meteor too, it was in the war 43-44 attacking V1 and V2 rockets and anything else that was in the air across the channel.

[Angus]

V2 was uninterceptable.

But the Meteors did indeed go on CAP's and hunt V-1's. They just didn't run into any LW aircraft. Well, there hardly were any around.

Makes one wonder, - how many hours on combat missions did the Meteors log compared to the 262's??????????????

[Phtom]

That I'm not sure of.  I do know they continued with the Meteor after the war..as the 262 continued I guess.

Would make for a fun dogfight though wouldn't it

I don't think either one was early enough in the war to make a great impact..not that they weren't great planes.

[Squire]

It was the best interceptor of its kind in 1945, by nature of its performance, and that is not disputed seriously by any student of WW2 history.

It had the same problems associated to all the LW combat a/c of 1945 (Bf 109, Fw 190, ect); problems with deliveries of spare parts, fuel, replacement pilots, and other infrastructure needed to sustain a modern air force in the field, that was not the fault of the Me 262 design. It arrived during the last year of the war in Europe.

As far as "causing a one percent loss on its best day" thats a silly claim, because it takes a small # of fighters and compares it to the overall side it intercepted, and tries to make it sound insignificant. Its a gross over generalisation. How many a/c did the Russians, RAF and USAAF have up that day? should we compare them to all that? its nonsensical.

You would not have wanted to be the bomber group who got intercepted by them, 262s caused a lot of consternation amongst bomber crews, and for good reason, the defensive weapons on bombers of the day were of little use against a fast moving jet fighter.

As far as being hard to land, I have never seen that written anywhere about it. Its engines did require a lot of maintenance, thats true.

[E25280]

I am not sure what "myth" you are referring to.  Sure, there were small numbers relative to other fighters/interceptors.  Due to the disintegration of record keeping late in the war for the LW, the exact number of kills registered by 262s are in dispute, but many sources put the number above 500.  That seems fairly significant to me given its limited use.

[Phtom]

CC

That's why I said many times..I agreed it was a good plane, my point was that its true effectiveness was never really utilized due to how late in the war it became operational, how the LW had trouble organizing parts and properly trained mechanics for it.  And maybe because it was up against so many planes..it was too little too late.

The point about takeoff and landing was from something I read that because of the longer runways needed for takeoff speed and for landing it made the 262 vulnerable.  It got to a point where they would scramble planes over so the planes could get up and down without a RL vulch situation.  Many 262's and their supplies were torn up on the ground, and on their landing.  

Don't get me wrong it was a great plane, as was the meteor (and at the end of the war the F7 which did not get sent in time for combat).  I was just pointing out its limited effectiveness.  That's all.

[68DevilM]

Originally posted by Angus
V2 was uninterceptable.

now ive heard that spits used to dive on them from high alt to killem

[Mathman]

Dove on the V1, not the V2

V1


V2

[Airscrew]

I think you're confusing the V-1 with the V-2.  V-1 was like a ramjet/rocket powered glide bomb (think early cruise missile)  V-2 was a large rocket, a kind of early balistic missile

[Phtom]

Where I found the info on the meteor against the V1 was here:
http://www.warbirdalley.com/meteor.htm

It credits them with V1 kills but not any V2 kills.

[68DevilM]

Originally posted by Mathman
Dove on the V1, not the V2

V1


V2

i did.....

[Furball]

if the allies had needed the Meteor, it was there ready.  It was used in combat, but very cautiously because the Spits, Tempests, Typhoons, Mustangs of the 2nd TAF were doing the job fine without the Meteor.  It was not worth the risk then in case it fell into enemy hands.

It is like today, why would you do a job with an untested F22 when a F-16 can do the job?

The Meteor was needed for testing (a luxury the LW didnt have) and to combat the V-1's.

If the Allies had been in the German position, obviously the Meteor would have seen a lot more action... probably the RAF could have rushed other types into production too had it been deemed necessary (such as the DeHavilland Vampire which first flew in 1943).

[Phtom]

Nice looking plane there.  
Looks like a jet version of a P38 or F7

[MiloMorai]

If someone has the Classic JV44 book they can look up the day when the 262 used the R4M missiles. Destroyed bombers was in the double digits. Not much in the overall picture, though.

[Glasses]

In A. Price's Book "The last Year of the LW" it was quoted that by the last couple of months the bulk of LW sorties were being taken care of by the Jet squadrons since the Jet fuel was much more readily available than the Gasoline that was needed to fuel most of the other LW conventional aircraft.