Author Topic: Does anyone remember this incident? (Read 937 times)

xrtoronto · « **on:** July 29, 2006, 03:23:40 PM »

Was doing some reading and came across this:

link

I was around at the time, but remember nothing of this incident. All new to me.

nirvana · « **Reply #1 on:** July 29, 2006, 03:26:12 PM »

Why did Israel attack a US ship?

AWMac · « **Reply #2 on:** July 29, 2006, 03:37:49 PM »

Yeah I remembered reading about this...sad.

Ack-Ack · « **Reply #3 on:** July 29, 2006, 03:47:49 PM »

IIRC happened during the Yom Kippor (sp?) War. Israel claims to have mistaken the ship for an Egyptian spy trawler despite having the US ensign prominatly displayed. Recall seeing an interview with some admiral that I think was the flag admiral of a US carrier task force that was in the area of the Liberty. He ordered the entire compliment of aircraft loaded up and ready for an alpha strike to retaliate but was told to stand down.

Was it an accident? Personally I don't think it was but on the other hand, what would have the Israelis have gained by sinking the Liberty? One scenerio was that since the Liberty was a intelligence gathering ship, it would have intercepted radio signals from the Israelis and potentially exposing their plans to invade Egypt.

ack-ack

GtoRA2 · « **Reply #4 on:** July 29, 2006, 04:47:07 PM »

I have heard about it over the years. I wonder how big of a deal the media made out of it then?

Does not seem well known at all.

101ABN · « **Reply #5 on:** July 29, 2006, 05:22:12 PM »

ive heard about this attack before... its one of our lessons during MI school.. its another case of shakey fingers on the trigger.. the mind gets a bit jumbled during conflict.... another case of this, US destroyer (or cruiser.. cant remember) shoots down a Iranian Airliner during the Iran Iraq war, just watched a show on it last night on discovery channel..

dmf · « **Reply #6 on:** July 29, 2006, 06:38:23 PM »

Before my time, don't remember it from History either. ( maybe thats the part I slept through)

Maverick · « **Reply #7 on:** July 29, 2006, 06:51:16 PM »

I recall it. No matter what you want to believe, on purppose or accident, it was a serious situation and came close to really harming relations between the US and Isreal. The "official" story was it was a case of mistaken identity. Whether that is tyhe truth or not is really unknown except to the pilots that conducted the attack. It shouldn't have happened, but I don't know which story to believe myself.

xrtoronto · « **Reply #8 on:** July 29, 2006, 07:06:18 PM »

I have been reading thru this long article a little bit at a time (it has dozens and dozens of links) and found about a third of the way down:

"During the Six Day War between Israel and the Arab States, the American intelligence ship USS Liberty was attacked for 75 minutes in international waters by Israeli aircraft and motor torpedo boats. Thirty-four men died and 174 were wounded."

attack was 75 minutes?? I originally thought it was one single mistake, not an entire attack

Toad · « **Reply #9 on:** July 29, 2006, 07:55:49 PM »

It was a big deal at the time.

I find it extremely hard to believe that it was accidental.

Unfortunately, LBJ and McNamara chose not to confront Israel.

Carter/Mondale accepted Israel's offer of reparations and closed the issue right when Senator Adlai Stevenson called a news conference in which he announced that he was convinced that the attack was deliberate and that the survivors deserved an investigation. After the "deal" Congress couldn't be bothered with the Liberty incident.

The rumor is we increased aid to Israel every year by the same amount they payed us on the installment plan.

midnight Target · « **Reply #10 on:** July 29, 2006, 08:20:37 PM »

They kept saying "woops" every time they fired for 75 minutes... so all was forgiven.

Toad · « **Reply #11 on:** July 29, 2006, 08:25:05 PM »

But not forgotten.

They tried to stiff us on improvements they made to our electronic warfare gear too. They significantly improved some of the stuff and proved it in the Bekaa Valley air battle. When we asked about it, they refused to show us the improvements. We eventually got to see some of it when some military deliveries to them were held up due to unforseen circumstances. I don't think we ever saw everything though.

They play us for chumps when they feel the need.

Rolex · « **Reply #12 on:** July 29, 2006, 10:18:51 PM »

I remember it also.

As far as the press, 1967 was a year for dramatic news beyond the 6-day war. It was lead story on TV for a few days, but other bad news took over soon.

Vietnam was spooling up with the first 100+/week US battle deaths.
It was a long, hot summer of the worst race riots in the history of the US.
China tested its first hydrogen device.
The Apollo astronauts died in an inferno.

For me, the question about the Liberty was always about the failure of the ship to respond to identification challenges by radio and its response to the shots across the bow by firing at the Israeli boats.

It's important to note that these intelligence gathering (spy) ships do not fly a flag when under way. They may or may not raise a flag when challenged. Either way, someone on either side made a mistake. More likely, it was a combination of mistakes by both sides.

Just like the Pueblo capture by North Korea later (which raised a flag after being challenged), two camps evolved. Some said both captains should have been court martialed and others said they should be given a medal.

One got a medal, the other was recommended for court martial, but the Secretary of the Navy overruled it.

Toad · « **Reply #13 on:** July 30, 2006, 09:52:58 AM »

Interesting read here; this an NSA report written long after the action.

I don't recall any reports of radio challenges to the Liberty though. Where have you seen that?

Toad · « **Reply #14 on:** July 30, 2006, 10:54:06 AM »

A rather truncated, confusing post.

Do we both agree there are no reports of Liberty ever being challenged by radio?

Second, I have seen NO reports that the torpedo boats tried to signal Liberty. I have seen reports that they immediately continued the attack started by Israeli aircraft. The torpedo boats showed up after Liberty had been attacked from the air and napalmed. The torpedo boats shot, IIRC, 5 torps, scoring one hit.